no meaningful difference in post-match no meaningful difference in post-match no meaningful difference in post-match recovery or long-term physical recovery or long-term physical recovery or long-term physical performance when comparing cold water performance when comparing cold water performance when comparing cold water immersion, hot immersion, or even immersion, hot immersion, or even immersion, hot immersion, or even placebo recovery methods. So, once placebo recovery methods. So, once placebo recovery methods. So, once again, meh. again, meh. again, meh. >> Yeah, that's kind of kind of the >> Yeah, that's kind of kind of the >> Yeah, that's kind of kind of the takeaway here, right? It's like takeaway here, right? It's like takeaway here, right? It's like [Music] >> Hello and welcome back to the How to >> Hello and welcome back to the How to >> Hello and welcome back to the How to Fitness podcast with me, Kate Lyman, Fitness podcast with me, Kate Lyman,
folks eat this. Anyway, I don't I wanted folks eat this. Anyway, I don't I wanted to know like what the the frequency of to know like what the the frequency of to know like what the the frequency of assault you've experienced. assault you've experienced. assault you've experienced. >> It's probably also like algorithm. It >> It's probably also like algorithm. It >> It's probably also like algorithm. It shows you one video and you probably shows you one video and you probably shows you one video and you probably watched it for a bit too long and it's watched it for a bit too long and it's watched it for a bit too long and it's like Kate loves like Kate loves like Kate loves >> ground beef and bananas. >> ground beef and bananas. >> ground beef and bananas. >> Really wants to eat this. Um no, miss me >> Really wants to eat this. Um no, miss me >> Really wants to eat this. Um no, miss me with that. You will never catch me with that. You will never catch me with that. You will never catch me eating that and I can say never
the same thing, right? Um, and I know the same thing, right? Um, and I know that you always feel amazing afterwards. that you always feel amazing afterwards. that you always feel amazing afterwards. Whether the actual health benefits are Whether the actual health benefits are Whether the actual health benefits are there, who knows? We will discuss that there, who knows? We will discuss that there, who knows? We will discuss that today. But, um, yeah, it's people either today. But, um, yeah, it's people either today. But, um, yeah, it's people either love it or they're like, "Heck no, I'm love it or they're like, "Heck no, I'm love it or they're like, "Heck no, I'm not doing that. It sounds awful." So, not doing that. It sounds awful." So, not doing that. It sounds awful." So, it's, um, yeah, it's cool topic. it's, um, yeah, it's cool topic. it's, um, yeah, it's cool topic. >> I'm really excited to learn because when >> I'm really excited to learn because when >> I'm really excited to learn because when it comes to like biohacking tools, this it comes to like biohacking tools, this it comes to like biohacking tools, this this totally fits into like the
where people sit in wheelie bins uh full where people sit in wheelie bins uh full of ice. So, so yeah, we're discussing of ice. So, so yeah, we're discussing of ice. So, so yeah, we're discussing ice baths today or um or it's often ice baths today or um or it's often ice baths today or um or it's often called as I mentioned its fancier name called as I mentioned its fancier name called as I mentioned its fancier name of cold water immersion. Um, and you've of cold water immersion. Um, and you've of cold water immersion. Um, and you've seen it everywhere from athletes, seen it everywhere from athletes, seen it everywhere from athletes, influencers, Wimhof breathing his way influencers, Wimhof breathing his way influencers, Wimhof breathing his way through frozen lakes. I'm sure anyone through frozen lakes. I'm sure anyone through frozen lakes. I'm sure anyone who's known about cold water immersion, who's known about cold water immersion, who's known about cold water immersion, um, probably aware of Wimhof and how um, probably aware of Wimhof and how um, probably aware of Wimhof and how much of a fan he was of this thing. I
reference, we're going to plug into the show notes. Um, so all the research show notes. Um, so all the research show notes. Um, so all the research nerds can delve into it a little bit nerds can delve into it a little bit nerds can delve into it a little bit deeper. And if you don't like what I deeper. And if you don't like what I deeper. And if you don't like what I say, take it up with the researchers, say, take it up with the researchers, say, take it up with the researchers, not me. I'm just reporting what they not me. I'm just reporting what they not me. I'm just reporting what they find. find. find. >> Don't shoot the messenger, please. But >> Don't shoot the messenger, please. But >> Don't shoot the messenger, please. But that's you all the time, right? that's you all the time, right? that's you all the time, right? >> Yeah. Exactly. And have you ever done >> Yeah. Exactly. And have you ever done >> Yeah. Exactly. And have you ever done Sorry, you did say you have done it. Sorry, you did say you have done it.
long before Instagram reals and as Kate long before Instagram reals and as Kate mentioned, the biohackers um kind of got mentioned, the biohackers um kind of got mentioned, the biohackers um kind of got their hands on it. So, take Scandinavia their hands on it. So, take Scandinavia their hands on it. So, take Scandinavia for example. Ice swimming and plunging for example. Ice swimming and plunging for example. Ice swimming and plunging into frozen lakes after a sauna is a into frozen lakes after a sauna is a into frozen lakes after a sauna is a long-standing tradition. Um, in Russia, long-standing tradition. Um, in Russia, long-standing tradition. Um, in Russia, people cut holes in frozen rivers for people cut holes in frozen rivers for people cut holes in frozen rivers for what they call I I was going to try to what they call I I was going to try to what they call I I was going to try to pronounce this, but now I'm backing out pronounce this, but now I'm backing out pronounce this, but now I'm backing out because I feel like I'm going to because I feel like I'm going to because I feel like I'm going to embarrass myself. I should have looked
interesting to me. But then like I interesting to me. But then like I haven't heard about him in a while. So haven't heard about him in a while. So haven't heard about him in a while. So you said he's problematic and I'm you said he's problematic and I'm you said he's problematic and I'm assuming that there's something assuming that there's something assuming that there's something happened. happened. happened. >> Yeah, there's been lots of claims about >> Yeah, there's been lots of claims about >> Yeah, there's been lots of claims about abuse from him. Um so I don't know them abuse from him. Um so I don't know them abuse from him. Um so I don't know them in enough detail to go into depth. Um I in enough detail to go into depth. Um I in enough detail to go into depth. Um I don't want to get sued. Um, however, don't want to get sued. Um, however, don't want to get sued. Um, however, there has been a lot of abuse claims there has been a lot of abuse claims there has been a lot of abuse claims that seem like they hold up pretty well.
Literally. Yeah. 10 points. 10 points to Literally. Yeah. 10 points. 10 points to Kate. Yeah. Um I was going to list Kate. Yeah. Um I was going to list Kate. Yeah. Um I was going to list through and through here, but you've through and through here, but you've through and through here, but you've literally named all of them. So, so literally named all of them. So, so literally named all of them. So, so yeah, there's a lot of claims um that uh yeah, there's a lot of claims um that uh yeah, there's a lot of claims um that uh you will hear from people. However, you will hear from people. However, you will hear from people. However, there's so much nuance around it. Um so, there's so much nuance around it. Um so, there's so much nuance around it. Um so, just to kind of put out the statement just to kind of put out the statement just to kind of put out the statement now, like not all of the claims are now, like not all of the claims are now, like not all of the claims are equally supported by science. Um and equally supported by science. Um and equally supported by science. Um and that's what we're about to find out. So,
don't fit that demographic um you also don't fit that demographic um you also need to be a little bit wary that the need to be a little bit wary that the need to be a little bit wary that the findings also might even be less findings also might even be less findings also might even be less beneficial or even more harmful um than beneficial or even more harmful um than beneficial or even more harmful um than is being reported in the literature too. is being reported in the literature too. is being reported in the literature too. Do you do you know in that meta analysis Do you do you know in that meta analysis Do you do you know in that meta analysis how the the split between male female? how the the split between male female? how the the split between male female? >> I can't remember it off the top of my >> I can't remember it off the top of my >> I can't remember it off the top of my head unfortunately. It did say it in head unfortunately. It did say it in head unfortunately. It did say it in there but I should have Yeah, it did. there but I should have Yeah, it did. there but I should have Yeah, it did. But it's as I said it was it was very
they'll call it like cold water they'll call it like cold water immersion or whatever and it's standing immersion or whatever and it's standing immersion or whatever and it's standing under a cold shower, others are sitting under a cold shower, others are sitting under a cold shower, others are sitting in a really cold ice bath. Um, so the in a really cold ice bath. Um, so the in a really cold ice bath. Um, so the temperatures also massively vary. temperatures also massively vary. temperatures also massively vary. Therefore, trying to find out what works Therefore, trying to find out what works Therefore, trying to find out what works and doesn't is really difficult because and doesn't is really difficult because and doesn't is really difficult because the research is so thin once again on the research is so thin once again on the research is so thin once again on all of those all of those all of those >> because I'm thinking of like the hot and >> because I'm thinking of like the hot and >> because I'm thinking of like the hot and cold, right? Like the sauna and cold
water consistently blunts hypertrophy water consistently blunts hypertrophy with smaller muscle growth seen in the with smaller muscle growth seen in the with smaller muscle growth seen in the ice bath groups. Those strength outcomes ice bath groups. Those strength outcomes ice bath groups. Those strength outcomes were often less affected. So, to put it were often less affected. So, to put it were often less affected. So, to put it really simply, if you're chasing size or really simply, if you're chasing size or really simply, if you're chasing size or strength, hopping into an ice bath strength, hopping into an ice bath strength, hopping into an ice bath straight after lifting is is going to straight after lifting is is going to straight after lifting is is going to slow your progress. slow your progress. slow your progress. >> That one makes a lot of sense to me, >> That one makes a lot of sense to me, >> That one makes a lot of sense to me, right? right? right? >> Like that one's pretty by the sounds of
isn't boosted, um, some updates from isn't boosted, um, some updates from 2022 suggested that cold water immersion 2022 suggested that cold water immersion 2022 suggested that cold water immersion might help particular power measures might help particular power measures might help particular power measures recover faster. Um, one review noted recover faster. Um, one review noted recover faster. Um, one review noted potential improvements in muscular power potential improvements in muscular power potential improvements in muscular power performance, muscle soreness, and performance, muscle soreness, and performance, muscle soreness, and perceived recovery after highintensity perceived recovery after highintensity perceived recovery after highintensity efforts. But once again, very thin on efforts. But once again, very thin on efforts. But once again, very thin on the ground with research there. This the ground with research there. This the ground with research there. This final study on this point, um, just to final study on this point, um, just to final study on this point, um, just to kind of hammer it home, is a 2025 study
and strength gains aspect is if you're and strength gains aspect is if you're dampening inflammation after doing a dampening inflammation after doing a dampening inflammation after doing a workout, you're probably going to be workout, you're probably going to be workout, you're probably going to be dampening your progress. Um, so this is dampening your progress. Um, so this is dampening your progress. Um, so this is why we say to use ice baths really why we say to use ice baths really why we say to use ice baths really strategically, not automatically. So strategically, not automatically. So strategically, not automatically. So yeah, it does it does help, but very yeah, it does it does help, but very yeah, it does it does help, but very very kind of marginally or maybe not very kind of marginally or maybe not very kind of marginally or maybe not very helpfully. Anyway, immune function. very helpfully. Anyway, immune function. very helpfully. Anyway, immune function. Another one that Kate nailed is is so Another one that Kate nailed is is so Another one that Kate nailed is is so unbelievably shaky. So, one large
online around ice baths about how it can online around ice baths about how it can like activate your brown fat and make like activate your brown fat and make like activate your brown fat and make you burn calories like a furnace. you burn calories like a furnace. you burn calories like a furnace. There's actually a TV show with a There's actually a TV show with a There's actually a TV show with a well-known TV doctor here who sadly well-known TV doctor here who sadly well-known TV doctor here who sadly passed away, but he did a kind of deep passed away, but he did a kind of deep passed away, but he did a kind of deep dive into cold water immersion and dive into cold water immersion and dive into cold water immersion and burning fat. And he was kind of raving burning fat. And he was kind of raving burning fat. And he was kind of raving about how great it was. But let's about how great it was. But let's about how great it was. But let's quickly unpack it. So, just for people quickly unpack it. So, just for people quickly unpack it. So, just for people listening so we know, there's two
TikTok are are quite overstated. Um plus TikTok are are quite overstated. Um plus also, which is important to note is your also, which is important to note is your also, which is important to note is your body adapts. So the more you do it, the body adapts. So the more you do it, the body adapts. So the more you do it, the less dramatic that calorie burn becomes less dramatic that calorie burn becomes less dramatic that calorie burn becomes over time. So yes, brown fat is real. Um over time. So yes, brown fat is real. Um over time. So yes, brown fat is real. Um cold water can switch it on, but is is cold water can switch it on, but is is cold water can switch it on, but is is an ice bath going to replace like an ice bath going to replace like an ice bath going to replace like lifting weights or going for a run? And lifting weights or going for a run? And lifting weights or going for a run? And um absolutely not. Um this is going to um absolutely not. Um this is going to um absolutely not. Um this is going to be like a tiny bonus, a tiny top up. be like a tiny bonus, a tiny top up. be like a tiny bonus, a tiny top up. >> This isn't a matter of white fat
significantly. It doesn't mean chronic significantly. It doesn't mean chronic inflammation, but an immediate response inflammation, but an immediate response inflammation, but an immediate response to that shock. Um, so that was always to that shock. Um, so that was always to that shock. Um, so that was always just quite an important thing to note. just quite an important thing to note. just quite an important thing to note. Um, in regards to stress, it doesn't Um, in regards to stress, it doesn't Um, in regards to stress, it doesn't budget right away. And I thought this budget right away. And I thought this budget right away. And I thought this was quite cool is immediately like 1 was quite cool is immediately like 1 was quite cool is immediately like 1 hour after no impact. 24 or 48 hours hour after no impact. 24 or 48 hours hour after no impact. 24 or 48 hours later, no impact. But there's like a later, no impact. But there's like a later, no impact. But there's like a shortterm benefit. So about 12 hours shortterm benefit. So about 12 hours shortterm benefit. So about 12 hours after you do cold water immersion, there
cuz I as I said, I haven't done it kind cuz I as I said, I haven't done it kind of since having kids because my mornings of since having kids because my mornings of since having kids because my mornings are now not free to go for a swim are now not free to go for a swim are now not free to go for a swim unfortunately. But like yes, I used to unfortunately. But like yes, I used to unfortunately. But like yes, I used to go new cold water swimming and I feel go new cold water swimming and I feel go new cold water swimming and I feel great afterwards. But was it the fact great afterwards. But was it the fact great afterwards. But was it the fact that I was having a nice morning at the that I was having a nice morning at the that I was having a nice morning at the beach with my friends having a swim or beach with my friends having a swim or beach with my friends having a swim or was it the cold water that made me feel was it the cold water that made me feel was it the cold water that made me feel great? Like it's it's hard to really great? Like it's it's hard to really great? Like it's it's hard to really measure that.
tragic accidents in open water swimmers tragic accidents in open water swimmers who jump straight into freezing lakes. who jump straight into freezing lakes. who jump straight into freezing lakes. Um it's not necessarily the cold itself Um it's not necessarily the cold itself Um it's not necessarily the cold itself that gets them. It's like the shock that that gets them. It's like the shock that that gets them. It's like the shock that comes from jumping into the cold water. comes from jumping into the cold water. comes from jumping into the cold water. >> Side note, did you ever as a kid go to a >> Side note, did you ever as a kid go to a >> Side note, did you ever as a kid go to a hotel and then you'd like jump back and hotel and then you'd like jump back and hotel and then you'd like jump back and forth from the pool to the hot tub? I forth from the pool to the hot tub? I forth from the pool to the hot tub? I just remember my grandma being like, just remember my grandma being like, just remember my grandma being like, "Don't do that. You'll die. A child died "Don't do that. You'll die. A child died "Don't do that. You'll die. A child died doing that." the shock, you know,
add, so you touched on this in the add, so you touched on this in the beginning, but actually a listener of beginning, but actually a listener of beginning, but actually a listener of our podcast had come to me and and kind our podcast had come to me and and kind our podcast had come to me and and kind of talked through one of these topics of of talked through one of these topics of of talked through one of these topics of saying, "Hey, I would love you guys to saying, "Hey, I would love you guys to saying, "Hey, I would love you guys to do an episode on ice baths and do an episode on ice baths and do an episode on ice baths and specifically talk about, you know, what specifically talk about, you know, what specifically talk about, you know, what the research says for males versus the research says for males versus the research says for males versus females." And it's like, we don't know. females." And it's like, we don't know. females." And it's like, we don't know. There's not a lot of it. There is a There's not a lot of it. There is a There's not a lot of it. There is a study I'm thinking of that I haven't
>> Yeah, if it was like two years ago I'm >> Yeah, if it was like two years ago I'm like I'm pretty shaky there. But I love like I'm pretty shaky there. But I love like I'm pretty shaky there. But I love how much we learned from doing these how much we learned from doing these how much we learned from doing these episodes from listening to your deep episodes from listening to your deep episodes from listening to your deep dives and doing my deep dives and dives and doing my deep dives and dives and doing my deep dives and everything else. So thank you all for everything else. So thank you all for everything else. So thank you all for listening. listening. listening. >> See you next time.