Kind: captions Language: en People are equally, if not more zealous People are equally, if not more zealous People are equally, if not more zealous about this modern culture than people about this modern culture than people about this modern culture than people were in previous religious cultures were in previous religious cultures were in previous religious cultures where the prize they have to win is so where the prize they have to win is so where the prize they have to win is so intensely identified, right, the status, intensely identified, right, the status, intensely identified, right, the status, power, wealth, that they're literally power, wealth, that they're literally power, wealth, that they're literally willing to themselves even in a slow mo willing to themselves even in a slow mo willing to themselves even in a slow mo fashion to achieve that prize. It's just fashion to achieve that prize. It's just fashion to achieve that prize. It's just like people are transfixed in a like people are transfixed in a like people are transfixed in a zombie-like fashion. They don't have zombie-like fashion. They don't have zombie-like fashion. They don't have control over themselves. Hi friends. Today we're going to talk Hi friends. Today we're going to talk Hi friends. Today we're going to talk about martyrdom culture that we about martyrdom culture that we about martyrdom culture that we masquerade as hero culture. Now I get masquerade as hero culture. Now I get masquerade as hero culture. Now I get it. You are ambitious. You are smart. it. You are ambitious. You are smart. it. You are ambitious. You are smart. You're talented. You have big dreams for You're talented. You have big dreams for You're talented. You have big dreams for life. You want to be rich and powerful life. You want to be rich and powerful life. You want to be rich and powerful and have high status. Those are all and have high status. Those are all and have high status. Those are all things everybody wants. Also, there is a things everybody wants. Also, there is a things everybody wants. Also, there is a way to go about doing it that does not way to go about doing it that does not way to go about doing it that does not require you to martyr your health. A lot require you to martyr your health. A lot require you to martyr your health. A lot of people have this bad idea in their of people have this bad idea in their of people have this bad idea in their mind that if they compromise their

mind that if they compromise their mind that if they compromise their health that somehow it will help them health that somehow it will help them health that somehow it will help them achieve better success. Today we're achieve better success. Today we're achieve better success. Today we're going to highlight the evidence that going to highlight the evidence that going to highlight the evidence that shows that is a bad idea. You can in shows that is a bad idea. You can in shows that is a bad idea. You can in fact prioritize your health and achieve fact prioritize your health and achieve fact prioritize your health and achieve better outcomes in your success, better outcomes in your success, better outcomes in your success, happiness, and status. Let's go. You happiness, and status. Let's go. You happiness, and status. Let's go. You know, I've always wondered like what if know, I've always wondered like what if know, I've always wondered like what if a branch started growing out of my head? a branch started growing out of my head? a branch started growing out of my head? Like it was like Like it was like Like it was like >> two nights ago I had this dream. I would >> two nights ago I had this dream. I would >> two nights ago I had this dream. I would turn and there'd be like a root growing turn and there'd be like a root growing turn and there'd be like a root growing out of my skin in the middle of nowhere. out of my skin in the middle of nowhere. out of my skin in the middle of nowhere. It was like It was like It was like >> it's terrifying. >> it's terrifying. >> it's terrifying. >> At some point, do you like start >> At some point, do you like start >> At some point, do you like start creating little seedlings and like creating little seedlings and like creating little seedlings and like dropping little Brians all over the dropping little Brians all over the dropping little Brians all over the place? place? place? >> Like plant them in the yard. This true >> Like plant them in the yard. This true >> Like plant them in the yard. This true fusion. Like we think about merging with fusion. Like we think about merging with fusion. Like we think about merging with AI. AI. AI. >> It becomes this nightmare situation >> It becomes this nightmare situation >> It becomes this nightmare situation where you can't get away from these where you can't get away from these where you can't get away from these needy seedlings. needy seedlings. needy seedlings. >> And all all night long there's like >> And all all night long there's like >> And all all night long there's like Brian, Brian, shut up. I'm swear I'm Brian, Brian, shut up. I'm swear I'm Brian, Brian, shut up. I'm swear I'm going to cut you down. You got to be going to cut you down. You got to be going to cut you down. You got to be quiet. What's happening? quiet. What's happening? quiet. What's happening? >> Oh my god. >> Oh my god. >> Oh my god. >> Are we ready? >> Are we ready? >> Are we ready? >> Yes. Today we're going to talk about one >> Yes. Today we're going to talk about one >> Yes. Today we're going to talk about one of the biggest myths of modern life and of the biggest myths of modern life and of the biggest myths of modern life and that's the idea that you need to martyr that's the idea that you need to martyr that's the idea that you need to martyr your health in order to be successful.

your health in order to be successful. your health in order to be successful. This has been so ingrained into the This has been so ingrained into the This has been so ingrained into the psyche of people who want epic psyche of people who want epic psyche of people who want epic professional success. We're going to get professional success. We're going to get professional success. We're going to get to the bottom of why this silly myth of to the bottom of why this silly myth of to the bottom of why this silly myth of martyrdom has made itself a mainstay in martyrdom has made itself a mainstay in martyrdom has made itself a mainstay in our culture and why it's wrong and how our culture and why it's wrong and how our culture and why it's wrong and how you can make the corrective actions to you can make the corrective actions to you can make the corrective actions to get yourself back to peak health and get yourself back to peak health and get yourself back to peak health and peak performance. So you you're coming peak performance. So you you're coming peak performance. So you you're coming from the other side too, like you were from the other side too, like you were from the other side too, like you were you're a convert in this new wave of you're a convert in this new wave of you're a convert in this new wave of like looking after your health. So a lot like looking after your health. So a lot like looking after your health. So a lot of people a they don't realize that you of people a they don't realize that you of people a they don't realize that you built Brainree Benmo, sold it to PayPal built Brainree Benmo, sold it to PayPal built Brainree Benmo, sold it to PayPal for eBay for 800 million and so made a for eBay for 800 million and so made a for eBay for 800 million and so made a [ __ ] ton of money. And people hear that [ __ ] ton of money. And people hear that [ __ ] ton of money. And people hear that story and they think, "Wow, Brian, you story and they think, "Wow, Brian, you story and they think, "Wow, Brian, you are only doing what you're doing now are only doing what you're doing now are only doing what you're doing now because you had access to money and because you had access to money and because you had access to money and there's no way you could have been that there's no way you could have been that there's no way you could have been that successful." And recently, for the first successful." And recently, for the first successful." And recently, for the first time, I heard you say that you think time, I heard you say that you think time, I heard you say that you think that you would have made more money had that you would have made more money had that you would have made more money had you been sleeping better. Is that right? you been sleeping better. Is that right? you been sleeping better. Is that right? >> Unquestionably, I would have made more >> Unquestionably, I would have made more >> Unquestionably, I would have made more money and been more successful had I money and been more successful had I money and been more successful had I made health my top priority.

made health my top priority. made health my top priority. >> Can you like talk because I think a lot >> Can you like talk because I think a lot >> Can you like talk because I think a lot of people don't realize a lot of people of people don't realize a lot of people of people don't realize a lot of people aren't in the startup world. They're not aren't in the startup world. They're not aren't in the startup world. They're not building businesses. So you're building businesses. So you're building businesses. So you're specifically from what I understand you specifically from what I understand you specifically from what I understand you sold the company at a point where it hit sold the company at a point where it hit sold the company at a point where it hit a certain valuation but really primarily a certain valuation but really primarily a certain valuation but really primarily because you couldn't go on any longer. because you couldn't go on any longer. because you couldn't go on any longer. >> So the truth of the matter is that >> So the truth of the matter is that >> So the truth of the matter is that nobody is going to achieve peak success nobody is going to achieve peak success nobody is going to achieve peak success when your health is in a bad spot. And when your health is in a bad spot. And when your health is in a bad spot. And that is true for me and there's actually that is true for me and there's actually that is true for me and there's actually two of us in the call today on the two of us in the call today on the two of us in the call today on the podcast today that have gone through the podcast today that have gone through the podcast today that have gone through the same experience. Dr. Allen also went same experience. Dr. Allen also went same experience. Dr. Allen also went through the same trajectory as me, I through the same trajectory as me, I through the same trajectory as me, I think. Is that right, Dr. Mike? With uh think. Is that right, Dr. Mike? With uh think. Is that right, Dr. Mike? With uh emergency medicine emergency medicine emergency medicine >> to some extent. Yeah. I mean, um do you >> to some extent. Yeah. I mean, um do you >> to some extent. Yeah. I mean, um do you mean like mean like mean like uh are we using the B- word burnout? uh are we using the B- word burnout? uh are we using the B- word burnout? Like Like Like >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Oh, wow. >> Oh, wow. >> Oh, wow. >> Yeah, for sure. For sure. >> Yeah, for sure. For sure. >> Yeah, for sure. For sure. >> I mean, basically as well. Is it fair to >> I mean, basically as well. Is it fair to >> I mean, basically as well. Is it fair to say you and I were both introduced to a say you and I were both introduced to a say you and I were both introduced to a culture that sacrificed health for some

culture that sacrificed health for some culture that sacrificed health for some kind of professional idea of success? kind of professional idea of success? kind of professional idea of success? >> Yeah, I would say a professional ideal >> Yeah, I would say a professional ideal >> Yeah, I would say a professional ideal like it an expectation of how you behave like it an expectation of how you behave like it an expectation of how you behave in that profession. And I think both of in that profession. And I think both of in that profession. And I think both of us were um uh subject to that maybe even us were um uh subject to that maybe even us were um uh subject to that maybe even without even realizing it for a while. without even realizing it for a while. without even realizing it for a while. At least I was personally At least I was personally At least I was personally >> that's exactly what I would identify is >> that's exactly what I would identify is >> that's exactly what I would identify is that the systems that said hey we're that the systems that said hey we're that the systems that said hey we're going to tell you to behave like this going to tell you to behave like this going to tell you to behave like this like you know sleep like this eat like like you know sleep like this eat like like you know sleep like this eat like this look like this be like this not this look like this be like this not this look like this be like this not because the data says it's the best for because the data says it's the best for because the data says it's the best for you or because it produces the best you or because it produces the best you or because it produces the best outcomes do these things because the outcomes do these things because the outcomes do these things because the system designed by we don't even know system designed by we don't even know system designed by we don't even know who who who says to do these things and so I know says to do these things and so I know says to do these things and so I know for me in it's very true in in for me in it's very true in in for me in it's very true in in entrepreneurship ship culture. You are entrepreneurship ship culture. You are entrepreneurship ship culture. You are expected to sacrifice your health. So expected to sacrifice your health. So expected to sacrifice your health. So there's no amount of travel is too much.

there's no amount of travel is too much. there's no amount of travel is too much. There's no amount of sleep is too There's no amount of sleep is too There's no amount of sleep is too little. There's, you know, you can little. There's, you know, you can little. There's, you know, you can sacrifice your your exercise routines. sacrifice your your exercise routines. sacrifice your your exercise routines. You would eat junk food so long as your You would eat junk food so long as your You would eat junk food so long as your revenue is climbing, your employee count revenue is climbing, your employee count revenue is climbing, your employee count is increasing, you know, and you're is increasing, you know, and you're is increasing, you know, and you're raising more money. And so it just raising more money. And so it just raising more money. And so it just really is a a spectacular failure of our really is a a spectacular failure of our really is a a spectacular failure of our societal systems that have us do these societal systems that have us do these societal systems that have us do these things that are extremely detrimental to things that are extremely detrimental to things that are extremely detrimental to our individual health, our company's our individual health, our company's our individual health, our company's health, and everybody around us. And I health, and everybody around us. And I health, and everybody around us. And I think it's so silly that we have bought think it's so silly that we have bought think it's so silly that we have bought into these notions. So I say, you know, into these notions. So I say, you know, into these notions. So I say, you know, it's relevant here that I did this as an it's relevant here that I did this as an it's relevant here that I did this as an entrepreneur, Mike did this in the in entrepreneur, Mike did this in the in entrepreneur, Mike did this in the in the medical world. So it's not just like the medical world. So it's not just like the medical world. So it's not just like one industry. Kate, you're in a for a one industry. Kate, you're in a for a one industry. Kate, you're in a for a fortunate situation where I mean, you fortunate situation where I mean, you fortunate situation where I mean, you tell me, but you're 29 years old and so, tell me, but you're 29 years old and so, tell me, but you're 29 years old and so, you know, I guess I'm curious on what you know, I guess I'm curious on what you know, I guess I'm curious on what your experience has been in terms of the your experience has been in terms of the your experience has been in terms of the the systems that you were introduced to the systems that you were introduced to the systems that you were introduced to in the world and how success was framed in the world and how success was framed in the world and how success was framed to you. But, uh, let me jump to Mike to you. But, uh, let me jump to Mike to you. But, uh, let me jump to Mike first, like Mike, would you say your

first, like Mike, would you say your first, like Mike, would you say your experience was similar to mine in terms experience was similar to mine in terms experience was similar to mine in terms of what the system told you to do and of what the system told you to do and of what the system told you to do and what it rewarded you to do? Yeah, I mean what it rewarded you to do? Yeah, I mean what it rewarded you to do? Yeah, I mean in the sense that I got exposed to in in the sense that I got exposed to in in the sense that I got exposed to in medicine a world where physicians are medicine a world where physicians are medicine a world where physicians are expected to just crush themselves. I expected to just crush themselves. I expected to just crush themselves. I mean it starts immediately from medical mean it starts immediately from medical mean it starts immediately from medical school. So like you know I thought school. So like you know I thought school. So like you know I thought undergrad was hard. you know, I did undergrad was hard. you know, I did undergrad was hard. you know, I did chemical engineering undergrad and like chemical engineering undergrad and like chemical engineering undergrad and like worked really hard and then then I worked really hard and then then I worked really hard and then then I started medical school and was just started medical school and was just started medical school and was just blown away by the expectations placed on blown away by the expectations placed on blown away by the expectations placed on medical students in terms of like how medical students in terms of like how medical students in terms of like how hard they had to study and then that hard they had to study and then that hard they had to study and then that compounded within residency and then compounded within residency and then compounded within residency and then professional life and it's just like a professional life and it's just like a professional life and it's just like a step-wise function of increasing step-wise function of increasing step-wise function of increasing expectations and a lack of focus on like expectations and a lack of focus on like expectations and a lack of focus on like personal health. like you never get personal health. like you never get personal health. like you never get taught how to be healthy and also be a taught how to be healthy and also be a taught how to be healthy and also be a professional in medicine at the same professional in medicine at the same professional in medicine at the same time. And it was just expected. Like time. And it was just expected. Like time. And it was just expected. Like there was no like there's no there was no like there's no there was no like there's no conversation. There was no like me conversation. There was no like me conversation. There was no like me sitting down in a medical school sitting down in a medical school sitting down in a medical school interview and then being like, "Hey, are interview and then being like, "Hey, are interview and then being like, "Hey, are you ready to sacrifice your health and you ready to sacrifice your health and you ready to sacrifice your health and your longevity for this this

your longevity for this this your longevity for this this profession?" Like nobody ever asked me profession?" Like nobody ever asked me profession?" Like nobody ever asked me that, right? It's just like, "Oh, being that, right? It's just like, "Oh, being that, right? It's just like, "Oh, being a doctor sounds great. You know, I want a doctor sounds great. You know, I want a doctor sounds great. You know, I want to help people." And then next thing you to help people." And then next thing you to help people." And then next thing you know, it's like, "I want to sacrifice my know, it's like, "I want to sacrifice my know, it's like, "I want to sacrifice my own health to help people." And that was own health to help people." And that was own health to help people." And that was never explicitly said to me. And I don't never explicitly said to me. And I don't never explicitly said to me. And I don't think I the same is true as an think I the same is true as an think I the same is true as an entrepreneur. I think entrepreneur. I think entrepreneur. I think >> is it clear I think I saw this stat >> is it clear I think I saw this stat >> is it clear I think I saw this stat correct me if I'm wrong in terms of life correct me if I'm wrong in terms of life correct me if I'm wrong in terms of life expectancy for medical professionals expectancy for medical professionals expectancy for medical professionals that emergency med doctors had the that emergency med doctors had the that emergency med doctors had the lowest I think it was like 59 or lowest I think it was like 59 or lowest I think it was like 59 or something like that. something like that. something like that. >> It's crazy low. It's very low. >> It's crazy low. It's very low. >> It's crazy low. It's very low. >> I mean had I known that I never would >> I mean had I known that I never would >> I mean had I known that I never would have gone into emergency medicine. You have gone into emergency medicine. You have gone into emergency medicine. You know, it's like somebody can't sell you know, it's like somebody can't sell you know, it's like somebody can't sell you on a career when they're like, "Hey, you on a career when they're like, "Hey, you on a career when they're like, "Hey, you know, by the way, you're probably going know, by the way, you're probably going know, by the way, you're probably going to die about 15 years younger than the to die about 15 years younger than the to die about 15 years younger than the average human." Cool, right? No. No average human." Cool, right? No. No average human." Cool, right? No. No thanks. thanks. thanks. >> Mike, you you were saying also something >> Mike, you you were saying also something >> Mike, you you were saying also something else about uh this being applicable not else about uh this being applicable not else about uh this being applicable not just to the medical world or just to the medical world or just to the medical world or entrepreneurship world, but entrepreneurship world, but entrepreneurship world, but >> yeah, I don't think this is just unique >> yeah, I don't think this is just unique >> yeah, I don't think this is just unique to medicine or the world of to medicine or the world of to medicine or the world of entrepreneurship. I think that this is

entrepreneurship. I think that this is entrepreneurship. I think that this is pretty much every professional career pretty much every professional career pretty much every professional career and almost like a societal level and almost like a societal level and almost like a societal level expectation that we crush ourselves uh expectation that we crush ourselves uh expectation that we crush ourselves uh for the benefit of our I don't even know for the benefit of our I don't even know for the benefit of our I don't even know what we're benefiting like theoretically what we're benefiting like theoretically what we're benefiting like theoretically I think there's some this theoretical I think there's some this theoretical I think there's some this theoretical benefit that you have to crush yourself benefit that you have to crush yourself benefit that you have to crush yourself in order to be successful in life or in in order to be successful in life or in in order to be successful in life or in order to like you know do good for order to like you know do good for order to like you know do good for mankind or or humankind but I but I mankind or or humankind but I but I mankind or or humankind but I but I don't think I think it's misguided. don't think I think it's misguided. don't think I think it's misguided. >> Yeah. You know, I could not agree with >> Yeah. You know, I could not agree with >> Yeah. You know, I could not agree with you more. I I think that in our global you more. I I think that in our global you more. I I think that in our global system that system that system that we are pawns we are pawns we are pawns for the system and we are disposable for for the system and we are disposable for for the system and we are disposable for the system's progress. But the insanity the system's progress. But the insanity the system's progress. But the insanity this moment is the system is the this moment is the system is the this moment is the system is the priority of the species and we are priority of the species and we are priority of the species and we are disposable. disposable. disposable. And we we compensate for that situation And we we compensate for that situation And we we compensate for that situation by trying to give ourselves trophies for by trying to give ourselves trophies for by trying to give ourselves trophies for success you know power wealth status but

success you know power wealth status but success you know power wealth status but it's a giant cope for the fact that we it's a giant cope for the fact that we it's a giant cope for the fact that we are martyrs for system bigger than are martyrs for system bigger than are martyrs for system bigger than ourselves and I think the opportunity ourselves and I think the opportunity ourselves and I think the opportunity here is to shift it to say we no long here is to shift it to say we no long here is to shift it to say we no long and this is like you when you when death and this is like you when you when death and this is like you when you when death is inevitable that's kind of the only is inevitable that's kind of the only is inevitable that's kind of the only thing you can do to cope or you can like thing you can do to cope or you can like thing you can do to cope or you can like you know identify an afterlife and be you know identify an afterlife and be you know identify an afterlife and be like actually there's a bigger system at like actually there's a bigger system at like actually there's a bigger system at play here and we're going to triumph play here and we're going to triumph play here and we're going to triumph over the system. But in practical terms, over the system. But in practical terms, over the system. But in practical terms, this is why I I think that what we're this is why I I think that what we're this is why I I think that what we're doing is don't die is correct that when doing is don't die is correct that when doing is don't die is correct that when existence itself becomes the priority, existence itself becomes the priority, existence itself becomes the priority, we are no longer pawns and will be we are no longer pawns and will be we are no longer pawns and will be arbitrageed in, you know, for the arbitrageed in, you know, for the arbitrageed in, you know, for the systems winning and but so it's like systems winning and but so it's like systems winning and but so it's like such a big concept, but we play these such a big concept, but we play these such a big concept, but we play these micro games of the modern to try to earn micro games of the modern to try to earn micro games of the modern to try to earn our own status, power, respect within our own status, power, respect within our own status, power, respect within the the circles we run. Kate, what's the the circles we run. Kate, what's the the circles we run. Kate, what's been your your I mean, you're 29 years been your your I mean, you're 29 years been your your I mean, you're 29 years old. What's been your life experience in old. What's been your life experience in old. What's been your life experience in terms of the culture that you walk into terms of the culture that you walk into terms of the culture that you walk into as a professional and what pressures do as a professional and what pressures do as a professional and what pressures do you feel? you feel? you feel? >> Yeah, I mean um being in the startup

>> Yeah, I mean um being in the startup >> Yeah, I mean um being in the startup community in New York, like you community in New York, like you community in New York, like you definitely feel the pressure to say, definitely feel the pressure to say, definitely feel the pressure to say, "Hey, I've been working so hard. I've "Hey, I've been working so hard. I've "Hey, I've been working so hard. I've been staying up all night working on been staying up all night working on been staying up all night working on this project." And then it's funny. I this project." And then it's funny. I this project." And then it's funny. I think in the fashion industry, there's a think in the fashion industry, there's a think in the fashion industry, there's a little bit more of a social pressure to little bit more of a social pressure to little bit more of a social pressure to go out, have drinks, connect with go out, have drinks, connect with go out, have drinks, connect with people. smoking is a little bit more people. smoking is a little bit more people. smoking is a little bit more prevalent in that community. So there's prevalent in that community. So there's prevalent in that community. So there's a little bit more of like this like cool a little bit more of like this like cool a little bit more of like this like cool person debaucherous behavior in the person debaucherous behavior in the person debaucherous behavior in the fashion community. So I think it's fashion community. So I think it's fashion community. So I think it's interesting like being in both worlds of interesting like being in both worlds of interesting like being in both worlds of startup and fashion back in the day. Um startup and fashion back in the day. Um startup and fashion back in the day. Um but yeah, I totally agree like we if you but yeah, I totally agree like we if you but yeah, I totally agree like we if you like really step back and look at it like really step back and look at it like really step back and look at it soberly, it's it's not a good situation. soberly, it's it's not a good situation. soberly, it's it's not a good situation. in my conversation with uh I primarily in my conversation with uh I primarily in my conversation with uh I primarily speak to founders and when they're going speak to founders and when they're going speak to founders and when they're going through this process and I can tell when through this process and I can tell when through this process and I can tell when I enter this conversation and I try to I enter this conversation and I try to I enter this conversation and I try to persuade them hey like let's just start persuade them hey like let's just start persuade them hey like let's just start with some baseline observations with some baseline observations with some baseline observations you do not want to write inefficient you do not want to write inefficient you do not want to write inefficient code right like your goal is to write

code right like your goal is to write code right like your goal is to write efficient code your goal is to run efficient code your goal is to run efficient code your goal is to run efficient hardware you don't want sloppy efficient hardware you don't want sloppy efficient hardware you don't want sloppy hardware you don't want sloppy software hardware you don't want sloppy software hardware you don't want sloppy software you want efficient systems you want efficient systems you want efficient systems You are software and hardware and you do You are software and hardware and you do You are software and hardware and you do not want to run sloppy software hardware not want to run sloppy software hardware not want to run sloppy software hardware on yourself and that's what happens when on yourself and that's what happens when on yourself and that's what happens when you don't make healthier top priority. you don't make healthier top priority. you don't make healthier top priority. Now like in those basic terms like they Now like in those basic terms like they Now like in those basic terms like they get it but then when they see themselves get it but then when they see themselves get it but then when they see themselves uh competing against other people who uh competing against other people who uh competing against other people who are willing to monitor themselves they are willing to monitor themselves they are willing to monitor themselves they feel like they're going to fall behind feel like they're going to fall behind feel like they're going to fall behind if they don't do it. So they don't take if they don't do it. So they don't take if they don't do it. So they don't take the same number of international trips the same number of international trips the same number of international trips if they're not you know uh sleeping 3 to if they're not you know uh sleeping 3 to if they're not you know uh sleeping 3 to four hours a night. they're not working four hours a night. they're not working four hours a night. they're not working that many hours in the day, even if that many hours in the day, even if that many hours in the day, even if they're not productive, like it's the they're not productive, like it's the they're not productive, like it's the perception that they're falling behind. perception that they're falling behind. perception that they're falling behind. But I have found it is incredibly hard But I have found it is incredibly hard But I have found it is incredibly hard to get people to feel comfortable they to get people to feel comfortable they to get people to feel comfortable they can safely prioritize their health and can safely prioritize their health and can safely prioritize their health and not fall behind. And they just won't let not fall behind. And they just won't let not fall behind. And they just won't let it go. They're so attached to this it go. They're so attached to this it go. They're so attached to this ideology just like it's almost like ideology just like it's almost like ideology just like it's almost like hanging from the monkey bars. Like you

hanging from the monkey bars. Like you hanging from the monkey bars. Like you you just can't like you feel like you if you just can't like you feel like you if you just can't like you feel like you if you let go you let go you let go >> there's there's no safety net. You're >> there's there's no safety net. You're >> there's there's no safety net. You're not going to be caught. What do you guys not going to be caught. What do you guys not going to be caught. What do you guys think that's about? think that's about? think that's about? >> Do you think that they believe in the >> Do you think that they believe in the >> Do you think that they believe in the first place that this is bad for them? I first place that this is bad for them? I first place that this is bad for them? I mean, I the first question, right? Like, mean, I the first question, right? Like, mean, I the first question, right? Like, do they even believe us? do they even believe us? do they even believe us? >> So, I would like to hypothesize that the >> So, I would like to hypothesize that the >> So, I would like to hypothesize that the person sitting on the other side person sitting on the other side person sitting on the other side listening to us right now is part of listening to us right now is part of listening to us right now is part of hustle culture and may not realize a hustle culture and may not realize a hustle culture and may not realize a that they're part of hustle culture and that they're part of hustle culture and that they're part of hustle culture and b that it's impacting their health. So I b that it's impacting their health. So I b that it's impacting their health. So I would love to go through like what it would love to go through like what it would love to go through like what it means, what happens to the individual means, what happens to the individual means, what happens to the individual when they are a porn in the system, when they are a porn in the system, when they are a porn in the system, assuming that we believe that for a assuming that we believe that for a assuming that we believe that for a second. What happens when you don't get second. What happens when you don't get second. What happens when you don't get enough sleep? What happens when you um enough sleep? What happens when you um enough sleep? What happens when you um are burnt out? The b word. And then once are burnt out? The b word. And then once are burnt out? The b word. And then once we So then once you once everyone's we So then once you once everyone's we So then once you once everyone's agreed upon those terms, Brian, that's agreed upon those terms, Brian, that's agreed upon those terms, Brian, that's when all of that angst kicks up because when all of that angst kicks up because when all of that angst kicks up because then you come face to face with like, then you come face to face with like, then you come face to face with like, wait, do I need to make a decision wait, do I need to make a decision wait, do I need to make a decision between myself and my company? And we between myself and my company? And we between myself and my company? And we can untangle that, too. can untangle that, too. can untangle that, too. >> Okay, cool. All right, let's jump into >> Okay, cool. All right, let's jump into >> Okay, cool. All right, let's jump into the evidence. We have a bunch of the evidence. We have a bunch of the evidence. We have a bunch of evidence prepared. Let's go over it and

evidence prepared. Let's go over it and evidence prepared. Let's go over it and let's see what effect let's see what effect let's see what effect uh hustle I mean I don't know if I even uh hustle I mean I don't know if I even uh hustle I mean I don't know if I even want to call it hustle culture because want to call it hustle culture because want to call it hustle culture because hustling is a good thing. So like hustling is a good thing. So like hustling is a good thing. So like is there a word we can use that it's is there a word we can use that it's is there a word we can use that it's like almost um destructive >> because people >> because people >> because people >> it's just work culture. It's just >> it's just work culture. It's just >> it's just work culture. It's just current work culture. current work culture. current work culture. >> Work is a positive word. We needed >> Work is a positive word. We needed >> Work is a positive word. We needed something that captures that it's an something that captures that it's an something that captures that it's an illusion illusion illusion like you. like you. like you. >> Oh, it's like um ma modern culture. >> Oh, it's like um ma modern culture. >> Oh, it's like um ma modern culture. >> Yeah, but it's modern culture >> Yeah, but it's modern culture >> Yeah, but it's modern culture masquerading as hero culture, masquerading as hero culture, masquerading as hero culture, >> right? >> right? >> right? >> All right, let's go through the >> All right, let's go through the >> All right, let's go through the evidence. We'll come back on the evidence. We'll come back on the evidence. We'll come back on the mimemetics. It's going to happen. It's mimemetics. It's going to happen. It's mimemetics. It's going to happen. It's coming. coming. coming. >> Yeah, it's coming. >> Yeah, it's coming. >> Yeah, it's coming. >> Okay, Mike, do you want to start us off >> Okay, Mike, do you want to start us off >> Okay, Mike, do you want to start us off with some of the evidence we put with some of the evidence we put with some of the evidence we put together as we evaluated this topic? together as we evaluated this topic? together as we evaluated this topic? >> Yeah. So, as we went through this, I >> Yeah. So, as we went through this, I >> Yeah. So, as we went through this, I think there's like three or four think there's like three or four think there's like three or four statements that we can make around the statements that we can make around the statements that we can make around the evidence um with regard to this type of evidence um with regard to this type of evidence um with regard to this type of culture whose word we haven't identified culture whose word we haven't identified culture whose word we haven't identified what it is yet. But basically, one

what it is yet. But basically, one what it is yet. But basically, one overwork will kill you. Two, working too overwork will kill you. Two, working too overwork will kill you. Two, working too much destroys your relationships. Three, much destroys your relationships. Three, much destroys your relationships. Three, all-nighters and sleep disruption causes all-nighters and sleep disruption causes all-nighters and sleep disruption causes heart disease and diabetes. And four, heart disease and diabetes. And four, heart disease and diabetes. And four, sleep disruption and overwork makes you sleep disruption and overwork makes you sleep disruption and overwork makes you a bad leader. So, let's let's break a bad leader. So, let's let's break a bad leader. So, let's let's break those down. So overwork will kill you. those down. So overwork will kill you. those down. So overwork will kill you. This has been well studied. There was a This has been well studied. There was a This has been well studied. There was a meta analysis in 2022 that basically meta analysis in 2022 that basically meta analysis in 2022 that basically came to the conclusion that burnout came to the conclusion that burnout came to the conclusion that burnout increases heart attack risk by 78%. Let increases heart attack risk by 78%. Let increases heart attack risk by 78%. Let that seep in for a second. Like burnout that seep in for a second. Like burnout that seep in for a second. Like burnout increases heart attack risk by 78%. increases heart attack risk by 78%. increases heart attack risk by 78%. That's huge. That's more than like most That's huge. That's more than like most That's huge. That's more than like most of the things that we talk about when of the things that we talk about when of the things that we talk about when we're talking about like taking supp we're talking about like taking supp we're talking about like taking supp certain supplements or exercising or certain supplements or exercising or certain supplements or exercising or like all of these things have fairly like all of these things have fairly like all of these things have fairly minimal in uh changes to your actual minimal in uh changes to your actual minimal in uh changes to your actual risk. 78% is is massive. And then there risk. 78% is is massive. And then there risk. 78% is is massive. And then there was another study that showed the amount was another study that showed the amount was another study that showed the amount of work, so working beyond 55 hours per of work, so working beyond 55 hours per of work, so working beyond 55 hours per week, was led to about 800,000 deaths week, was led to about 800,000 deaths week, was led to about 800,000 deaths from stroke and heart disease in 2016. from stroke and heart disease in 2016. from stroke and heart disease in 2016. And that those people who worked greater And that those people who worked greater And that those people who worked greater than 55 hours per week had a 35% higher

than 55 hours per week had a 35% higher than 55 hours per week had a 35% higher risk of stroke and a 17% higher risk of risk of stroke and a 17% higher risk of risk of stroke and a 17% higher risk of death from heart attack. So, we know death from heart attack. So, we know death from heart attack. So, we know without a shadow of a doubt that working without a shadow of a doubt that working without a shadow of a doubt that working too much, whether that's just the sense too much, whether that's just the sense too much, whether that's just the sense of the b- word burnout or if it's just of the b- word burnout or if it's just of the b- word burnout or if it's just the number of hours you're putting in a the number of hours you're putting in a the number of hours you're putting in a week actually has a direct impact on week actually has a direct impact on week actually has a direct impact on your your livelihood and how long you're your your livelihood and how long you're your your livelihood and how long you're going to live. going to live. going to live. >> So, Mike, in that let me let me be the >> So, Mike, in that let me let me be the >> So, Mike, in that let me let me be the devil's advocate in this. Okay, I just I devil's advocate in this. Okay, I just I devil's advocate in this. Okay, I just I just heard what you said and um I'm just heard what you said and um I'm just heard what you said and um I'm thinking, you know what, Mike, I get it. thinking, you know what, Mike, I get it. thinking, you know what, Mike, I get it. I'm not really interested in living, you I'm not really interested in living, you I'm not really interested in living, you know, 80 years of life. I'm okay to know, 80 years of life. I'm okay to know, 80 years of life. I'm okay to trade off my last 10 years of life so I trade off my last 10 years of life so I trade off my last 10 years of life so I can be epic in my 20s, make a ton of can be epic in my 20s, make a ton of can be epic in my 20s, make a ton of money, and then I can just reverse the money, and then I can just reverse the money, and then I can just reverse the damage I did in my 20s, I can do it in damage I did in my 20s, I can do it in damage I did in my 20s, I can do it in my 30s and 40s. So, I'm willing to to my 30s and 40s. So, I'm willing to to my 30s and 40s. So, I'm willing to to take this gamble and make the trade-off. take this gamble and make the trade-off. take this gamble and make the trade-off. Can you what's what's your argument Can you what's what's your argument Can you what's what's your argument there? there? there? Well, so first first off, it there's a Well, so first first off, it there's a Well, so first first off, it there's a difference between um making it up and difference between um making it up and difference between um making it up and then just having like worse actual

then just having like worse actual then just having like worse actual livelihood or um life quality during the livelihood or um life quality during the livelihood or um life quality during the years that you currently have. So the years that you currently have. So the years that you currently have. So the the counterargument to what you just the counterargument to what you just the counterargument to what you just suggested is that you're actually going suggested is that you're actually going suggested is that you're actually going to see lower performance the harder to see lower performance the harder to see lower performance the harder you're working. So when you're pushing you're working. So when you're pushing you're working. So when you're pushing yourself, you're likely not sleeping as yourself, you're likely not sleeping as yourself, you're likely not sleeping as much, right? You're likely not spending much, right? You're likely not spending much, right? You're likely not spending as much time with family and friends. as much time with family and friends. as much time with family and friends. You're hurting your social You're hurting your social You're hurting your social relationships. you're not sleeping, relationships. you're not sleeping, relationships. you're not sleeping, you're not eating appropriately, you're you're not eating appropriately, you're you're not eating appropriately, you're not exercising. All those things not exercising. All those things not exercising. All those things actually reduce your likelihood of um of actually reduce your likelihood of um of actually reduce your likelihood of um of of performing at the highest possible of performing at the highest possible of performing at the highest possible level. And this gets, I think, to what level. And this gets, I think, to what level. And this gets, I think, to what you were talking about, Brian, in terms you were talking about, Brian, in terms you were talking about, Brian, in terms of like you feel like um you could have of like you feel like um you could have of like you feel like um you could have been even more successful than you were been even more successful than you were been even more successful than you were had you been taking better care of had you been taking better care of had you been taking better care of yourself. And the research actually yourself. And the research actually yourself. And the research actually supports that statement. So, if we look supports that statement. So, if we look supports that statement. So, if we look at, for example, relationships, working at, for example, relationships, working at, for example, relationships, working too much destroys your relationships. too much destroys your relationships. too much destroys your relationships. That was the second statement that that That was the second statement that that That was the second statement that that we made. There was a um interesting uh we made. There was a um interesting uh we made. There was a um interesting uh trial that was done in Belgium where trial that was done in Belgium where trial that was done in Belgium where employees shifted to a 30-hour work week employees shifted to a 30-hour work week employees shifted to a 30-hour work week and they actually found that they had and they actually found that they had and they actually found that they had generally higher well-being, just a

generally higher well-being, just a generally higher well-being, just a sense of overall well-being. And that sense of overall well-being. And that sense of overall well-being. And that that was mostly uh generated by lower that was mostly uh generated by lower that was mostly uh generated by lower work and family conflict. And we've seen work and family conflict. And we've seen work and family conflict. And we've seen this time and time again in research this time and time again in research this time and time again in research studies where people who work more have studies where people who work more have studies where people who work more have more trouble with their f in their more trouble with their f in their more trouble with their f in their family life. they have more trouble in family life. they have more trouble in family life. they have more trouble in their in their relationships and they their in their relationships and they their in their relationships and they don't get as much uh general happiness don't get as much uh general happiness don't get as much uh general happiness from their life because they're just from their life because they're just from their life because they're just crushing themselves at work basically. crushing themselves at work basically. crushing themselves at work basically. Yeah. Okay, cool. So my my initial Yeah. Okay, cool. So my my initial Yeah. Okay, cool. So my my initial knee-jerk reaction to you would be uh knee-jerk reaction to you would be uh knee-jerk reaction to you would be uh lacking in lacking in lacking in awareness of the second and third and awareness of the second and third and awareness of the second and third and fourth order consequences that if I fourth order consequences that if I fourth order consequences that if I begin this process and I have some level begin this process and I have some level begin this process and I have some level of health deterioration of health deterioration of health deterioration that I am I'm thinking that it may only that I am I'm thinking that it may only that I am I'm thinking that it may only affect end of life and or that I can affect end of life and or that I can affect end of life and or that I can make it up in my 30s 40s. But what I'm make it up in my 30s 40s. But what I'm make it up in my 30s 40s. But what I'm not accounting for are the other points not accounting for are the other points not accounting for are the other points you laid out in the beginning to say you laid out in the beginning to say you laid out in the beginning to say it's going to begin uh the its ruinous it's going to begin uh the its ruinous it's going to begin uh the its ruinous effects on my relationships. It's going

effects on my relationships. It's going effects on my relationships. It's going to begin my ru it's going to begin uh to begin my ru it's going to begin uh to begin my ru it's going to begin uh lessening I it's going to diminish my lessening I it's going to diminish my lessening I it's going to diminish my abilities as a leader and it's going to abilities as a leader and it's going to abilities as a leader and it's going to have all these other following have all these other following have all these other following consequences. So my first reaction to consequences. So my first reaction to consequences. So my first reaction to you is is totally inaccurate. That is you is is totally inaccurate. That is you is is totally inaccurate. That is not the trade-off I'm making. It's a not the trade-off I'm making. It's a not the trade-off I'm making. It's a much more sophisticated cascade of much more sophisticated cascade of much more sophisticated cascade of consequences than I'm anticipating and I consequences than I'm anticipating and I consequences than I'm anticipating and I haven't fully groed what it really haven't fully groed what it really haven't fully groed what it really means. Is that fair? means. Is that fair? means. Is that fair? >> Yeah, that's totally fair. >> Yeah, that's totally fair. >> Yeah, that's totally fair. >> Yeah. And um specifically like there's a >> Yeah. And um specifically like there's a >> Yeah. And um specifically like there's a couple other stats here. Sleep couple other stats here. Sleep couple other stats here. Sleep restricted CEOs make 29% more risky restricted CEOs make 29% more risky restricted CEOs make 29% more risky errors in lab simulations. So like errors in lab simulations. So like errors in lab simulations. So like you're going to be a worse immediate you're going to be a worse immediate you're going to be a worse immediate leader. So, the trade-off of short-term leader. So, the trade-off of short-term leader. So, the trade-off of short-term to long-term falls flat when you're a to long-term falls flat when you're a to long-term falls flat when you're a worse CEO, leader, builder, worse CEO, leader, builder, worse CEO, leader, builder, er, medicine doctor. Um, and that fit er, medicine doctor. Um, and that fit er, medicine doctor. Um, and that fit workers log two extra productive hours workers log two extra productive hours workers log two extra productive hours per week. So, your productivity of per week. So, your productivity of per week. So, your productivity of either your team or yourself also either your team or yourself also either your team or yourself also increases with better health decisions increases with better health decisions increases with better health decisions in the immediate term.

in the immediate term. in the immediate term. >> You also make better decisions. Like >> You also make better decisions. Like >> You also make better decisions. Like that one study where they looked at that one study where they looked at that one study where they looked at Israeli judges. I find this one super Israeli judges. I find this one super Israeli judges. I find this one super impressive. So this was Israeli judges, impressive. So this was Israeli judges, impressive. So this was Israeli judges, judges that are determining whether judges that are determining whether judges that are determining whether someone should make parole or not. And someone should make parole or not. And someone should make parole or not. And they found that in the morning when they found that in the morning when they found that in the morning when they're most arrested that 65% of people they're most arrested that 65% of people they're most arrested that 65% of people made parole, but right before lunch 0% made parole, but right before lunch 0% made parole, but right before lunch 0% made parole. It's like the timing of day made parole. It's like the timing of day made parole. It's like the timing of day actually turn and this has been this has actually turn and this has been this has actually turn and this has been this has been shown in CEOs as well where not been shown in CEOs as well where not been shown in CEOs as well where not only are you making worse decisions, but only are you making worse decisions, but only are you making worse decisions, but you're actually like more pessimistic you're actually like more pessimistic you're actually like more pessimistic and less charismatic when you're tired. and less charismatic when you're tired. and less charismatic when you're tired. So there was a study looking at um at So there was a study looking at um at So there was a study looking at um at leaders who were sleepd deprived and in leaders who were sleepd deprived and in leaders who were sleepd deprived and in those sleep-d deprived leaders people those sleep-d deprived leaders people those sleep-d deprived leaders people perceived them as being less charismatic perceived them as being less charismatic perceived them as being less charismatic and they made poor decisions and did not and they made poor decisions and did not and they made poor decisions and did not lead their team quite as well which is lead their team quite as well which is lead their team quite as well which is like makes total sense when you think like makes total sense when you think like makes total sense when you think about it right I mean how often have you about it right I mean how often have you about it right I mean how often have you been sleepd deprived and then felt like been sleepd deprived and then felt like been sleepd deprived and then felt like you had less energy people pick up on you had less energy people pick up on you had less energy people pick up on that even if it's you know even if it's that even if it's you know even if it's that even if it's you know even if it's subconscious they pick up on the fact subconscious they pick up on the fact subconscious they pick up on the fact that you're not charismatic you're not that you're not charismatic you're not that you're not charismatic you're not as understanding you're not as kind like

as understanding you're not as kind like as understanding you're not as kind like that stuff makes total sense that stuff makes total sense that stuff makes total sense Quick detour here that in my personal Quick detour here that in my personal Quick detour here that in my personal life with really close interpersonal life with really close interpersonal life with really close interpersonal relationships, it it's become so obvious relationships, it it's become so obvious relationships, it it's become so obvious to me now that I'm like observing myself to me now that I'm like observing myself to me now that I'm like observing myself to have hard conversations before 5:00 to have hard conversations before 5:00 to have hard conversations before 5:00 p.m. If if it's 5:00 p.m., like you're p.m. If if it's 5:00 p.m., like you're p.m. If if it's 5:00 p.m., like you're the chance of a hard conversation going the chance of a hard conversation going the chance of a hard conversation going wrong is so much higher. So, just avoid wrong is so much higher. So, just avoid wrong is so much higher. So, just avoid it now. Cuz like if we all have this it now. Cuz like if we all have this it now. Cuz like if we all have this goal of working things out together, goal of working things out together, goal of working things out together, then it doesn't make any sense to do then it doesn't make any sense to do then it doesn't make any sense to do things after 5 p.m. that are difficult. things after 5 p.m. that are difficult. things after 5 p.m. that are difficult. My wife Britney and I have this um had My wife Britney and I have this um had My wife Britney and I have this um had this term when I was working er shifts this term when I was working er shifts this term when I was working er shifts called night shifted where uh we would called night shifted where uh we would called night shifted where uh we would specifically avoid difficult specifically avoid difficult specifically avoid difficult conversations after I was coming off a conversations after I was coming off a conversations after I was coming off a night shift. night shift. night shift. >> Yeah. Because >> Yeah. Because >> Yeah. Because >> 100%. because and I I recognized this >> 100%. because and I I recognized this >> 100%. because and I I recognized this too, but like um she picked up on the too, but like um she picked up on the too, but like um she picked up on the fact that like I was just so quick to um fact that like I was just so quick to um fact that like I was just so quick to um to cut her down or like say something to cut her down or like say something to cut her down or like say something negative or be pessimistic or like just negative or be pessimistic or like just negative or be pessimistic or like just be like aggro because I didn't get be like aggro because I didn't get be like aggro because I didn't get enough sleep, right? So like we

enough sleep, right? So like we enough sleep, right? So like we literally named it and like changed literally named it and like changed literally named it and like changed behavior around it. Like I remember this behavior around it. Like I remember this behavior around it. Like I remember this one time I was coming off of uh this was one time I was coming off of uh this was one time I was coming off of uh this was actually in residency um overshare for a actually in residency um overshare for a actually in residency um overshare for a minute. So I was coming off of a an ICU minute. So I was coming off of a an ICU minute. So I was coming off of a an ICU shift. It was one of those like 36-hour shift. It was one of those like 36-hour shift. It was one of those like 36-hour shifts. So, like not only are you awake shifts. So, like not only are you awake shifts. So, like not only are you awake like all throughout the night, but like all throughout the night, but like all throughout the night, but you're also working like 36 hours you're also working like 36 hours you're also working like 36 hours straight. And I was walking the dog. straight. And I was walking the dog. straight. And I was walking the dog. Actually, I was running the dog. And Actually, I was running the dog. And Actually, I was running the dog. And like this other dog came and started like this other dog came and started like this other dog came and started like running with us. And like I like running with us. And like I like running with us. And like I couldn't get it to go away. I was kind couldn't get it to go away. I was kind couldn't get it to go away. I was kind of shoe it away, right? It was just me of shoe it away, right? It was just me of shoe it away, right? It was just me and my dog running. I don't want this and my dog running. I don't want this and my dog running. I don't want this dog bothering us. And it's like running dog bothering us. And it's like running dog bothering us. And it's like running in and out of the street, runs in front in and out of the street, runs in front in and out of the street, runs in front of this car. And this nice old lady of this car. And this nice old lady of this car. And this nice old lady stops and she like says something to me stops and she like says something to me stops and she like says something to me and I don't really hear her, but I infer and I don't really hear her, but I infer and I don't really hear her, but I infer that she was saying something brood. And that she was saying something brood. And that she was saying something brood. And I just start cussing her out. Oh my god. I just start cussing her out. Oh my god. I just start cussing her out. Oh my god. >> Like >> Like >> Like she looked at me like I was the like the she looked at me like I was the like the she looked at me like I was the like the worst human in the world and just like worst human in the world and just like worst human in the world and just like drove away. And then like after she left drove away. And then like after she left drove away. And then like after she left I was like maybe she was trying to say I was like maybe she was trying to say I was like maybe she was trying to say something kind. something kind. something kind. >> I was so reactive and I was just I was >> I was so reactive and I was just I was >> I was so reactive and I was just I was night shifted, man. That's like all

night shifted, man. That's like all night shifted, man. That's like all there was to it. But like it just like there was to it. But like it just like there was to it. But like it just like it tells the story of like this it tells the story of like this it tells the story of like this pessimism and this this lack of like pessimism and this this lack of like pessimism and this this lack of like empathy that happens when we're when empathy that happens when we're when empathy that happens when we're when we're sleep deprived. And I think a lot we're sleep deprived. And I think a lot we're sleep deprived. And I think a lot of people don't even realize it. of people don't even realize it. of people don't even realize it. >> Yeah. Mike, if you really wanted to burn >> Yeah. Mike, if you really wanted to burn >> Yeah. Mike, if you really wanted to burn her, you'd be like, "You better hope her, you'd be like, "You better hope her, you'd be like, "You better hope you're not in the ER." you're not in the ER." you're not in the ER." >> Oh, man. I was like I was like, "F you, >> Oh, man. I was like I was like, "F you, >> Oh, man. I was like I was like, "F you, you effing." I mean, it was bad. It was you effing." I mean, it was bad. It was you effing." I mean, it was bad. It was like so not me. But like, that's what like so not me. But like, that's what like so not me. But like, that's what happens. happens. happens. >> Yeah. My in my first uh my previous >> Yeah. My in my first uh my previous >> Yeah. My in my first uh my previous relationship, I I tried to make this relationship, I I tried to make this relationship, I I tried to make this rule that, you know, like realizing that rule that, you know, like realizing that rule that, you know, like realizing that when 6 or 7 p.m. Brian arrived, like it when 6 or 7 p.m. Brian arrived, like it when 6 or 7 p.m. Brian arrived, like it was not a good situation for almost was not a good situation for almost was not a good situation for almost anything. I getting the kids bathed, anything. I getting the kids bathed, anything. I getting the kids bathed, fed, and put to bed was like the only fed, and put to bed was like the only fed, and put to bed was like the only thing I could muster up. And so I tried thing I could muster up. And so I tried thing I could muster up. And so I tried to introduce this concept, but uh my to introduce this concept, but uh my to introduce this concept, but uh my partner at the time uh needed to do partner at the time uh needed to do partner at the time uh needed to do emotional reconciliation. Like she felt emotional reconciliation. Like she felt emotional reconciliation. Like she felt like it was a necessity of her like it was a necessity of her like it was a necessity of her existence. And so she would break existence. And so she would break existence. And so she would break protocol and I would just plead with her

protocol and I would just plead with her protocol and I would just plead with her like we can't like if we do this, it's like we can't like if we do this, it's like we can't like if we do this, it's just going to go off the rails. It's just going to go off the rails. It's just going to go off the rails. It's going to make things worse. And she going to make things worse. And she going to make things worse. And she would persist. And so then it it was would persist. And so then it it was would persist. And so then it it was just an absolute nightmare where I tried just an absolute nightmare where I tried just an absolute nightmare where I tried to set the rules but then she needed to to set the rules but then she needed to to set the rules but then she needed to like address this like she had needs as like address this like she had needs as like address this like she had needs as well but it was just like this train well but it was just like this train well but it was just like this train wreck of a situation. wreck of a situation. wreck of a situation. >> Yeah. So um I've been on the other side >> Yeah. So um I've been on the other side >> Yeah. So um I've been on the other side of that where I'm like we need to have of that where I'm like we need to have of that where I'm like we need to have this conversation now like there's no this conversation now like there's no this conversation now like there's no way right but that's the crazy thing is way right but that's the crazy thing is way right but that's the crazy thing is that like consciousness makes you feel that like consciousness makes you feel that like consciousness makes you feel like who you are in the moment is you. like who you are in the moment is you. like who you are in the moment is you. And so until you can separate from that, And so until you can separate from that, And so until you can separate from that, like you just don't realize it. And so like you just don't realize it. And so like you just don't realize it. And so that's why it's so such a I feel so that's why it's so such a I feel so that's why it's so such a I feel so liberated to be on the other side of liberated to be on the other side of liberated to be on the other side of that now and be like, "Okay, absolutely that now and be like, "Okay, absolutely that now and be like, "Okay, absolutely after 5:00 p.m. Kate is bad at having after 5:00 p.m. Kate is bad at having after 5:00 p.m. Kate is bad at having emotional stability period. Any emotional stability period. Any emotional stability period. Any emotional like even with team members emotional like even with team members emotional like even with team members when I'm like going to have a hard when I'm like going to have a hard when I'm like going to have a hard conversation, I'm like be careful when I conversation, I'm like be careful when I conversation, I'm like be careful when I schedule it because I'm like I know I schedule it because I'm like I know I schedule it because I'm like I know I need to be my best self." Um so I

need to be my best self." Um so I need to be my best self." Um so I empathize with that situation. I think empathize with that situation. I think empathize with that situation. I think this conversation is like detangling this conversation is like detangling this conversation is like detangling who we are at different time periods and who we are at different time periods and who we are at different time periods and recognizing like when you are sleep. recognizing like when you are sleep. recognizing like when you are sleep. It's like in the situation with Mike, It's like in the situation with Mike, It's like in the situation with Mike, you could totally witness someone losing you could totally witness someone losing you could totally witness someone losing their temper and be like, have they their temper and be like, have they their temper and be like, have they slept recently? Like have empathy toward slept recently? Like have empathy toward slept recently? Like have empathy toward those situations because it's just like those situations because it's just like those situations because it's just like people don't realize what's good for people don't realize what's good for people don't realize what's good for them. them. them. >> Yeah. Okay. So, back to the evidence. So >> Yeah. Okay. So, back to the evidence. So >> Yeah. Okay. So, back to the evidence. So far, we've covered that you have far, we've covered that you have far, we've covered that you have dramatic increases in cardiovascular dramatic increases in cardiovascular dramatic increases in cardiovascular risk profile. 78% uh increased risk profile. 78% uh increased risk profile. 78% uh increased likelihood of heart attack. You're less likelihood of heart attack. You're less likelihood of heart attack. You're less charismatic. Your personal relationships charismatic. Your personal relationships charismatic. Your personal relationships become ruinous. Uh Kate, you mentioned become ruinous. Uh Kate, you mentioned become ruinous. Uh Kate, you mentioned on uh lessened sleep quality, I think. on uh lessened sleep quality, I think. on uh lessened sleep quality, I think. >> Oh, no. Mhm. >> Oh, no. Mhm. >> Oh, no. Mhm. >> Yeah. What other evidence do we have >> Yeah. What other evidence do we have >> Yeah. What other evidence do we have that suggests that this martyrdom that suggests that this martyrdom that suggests that this martyrdom culture masquerading as hero culture is culture masquerading as hero culture is culture masquerading as hero culture is bad for somebody? bad for somebody? bad for somebody? >> Well, there's also the um the phys >> Well, there's also the um the phys >> Well, there's also the um the phys physical fitness evidence. So the more physical fitness evidence. So the more physical fitness evidence. So the more physically fit you are, the less sick

physically fit you are, the less sick physically fit you are, the less sick you are. So um there's pretty close you are. So um there's pretty close you are. So um there's pretty close relationship between how um whether you relationship between how um whether you relationship between how um whether you exercise, what percentile of fitness exercise, what percentile of fitness exercise, what percentile of fitness you're in, and then how many days you you're in, and then how many days you you're in, and then how many days you miss of work a year. So not just in miss of work a year. So not just in miss of work a year. So not just in terms of like how well you perform, but terms of like how well you perform, but terms of like how well you perform, but also are you even at work. So the top also are you even at work. So the top also are you even at work. So the top 25th percentile of physical fitness 25th percentile of physical fitness 25th percentile of physical fitness misses on average about two days per misses on average about two days per misses on average about two days per year, whereas the bottom 25 percentile year, whereas the bottom 25 percentile year, whereas the bottom 25 percentile misses about six days per year. So misses about six days per year. So misses about six days per year. So you're actually making an investment in you're actually making an investment in you're actually making an investment in how much you're able to totally work by how much you're able to totally work by how much you're able to totally work by be by being physically fit. So it goes be by being physically fit. So it goes be by being physically fit. So it goes beyond just sleep gets into fitness and beyond just sleep gets into fitness and beyond just sleep gets into fitness and then also into diet. So if we roll into then also into diet. So if we roll into then also into diet. So if we roll into the diet realm, there's decisions around the diet realm, there's decisions around the diet realm, there's decisions around what we eat and a lot of times this what we eat and a lot of times this what we eat and a lot of times this martyrum culture makes poor decisions martyrum culture makes poor decisions martyrum culture makes poor decisions around diet out of convenience. And what around diet out of convenience. And what around diet out of convenience. And what we've seen is that cognitive performance we've seen is that cognitive performance we've seen is that cognitive performance tracks almost directly with diet in tracks almost directly with diet in tracks almost directly with diet in terms of the more convenient food that terms of the more convenient food that terms of the more convenient food that you eat. And by convenient, I'm talking you eat. And by convenient, I'm talking you eat. And by convenient, I'm talking about like ultrarocessed junk food,

about like ultrarocessed junk food, about like ultrarocessed junk food, quick food, fast food, things like that. quick food, fast food, things like that. quick food, fast food, things like that. Basically, what every serving of of this Basically, what every serving of of this Basically, what every serving of of this sort of food, ultrarocessed food that sort of food, ultrarocessed food that sort of food, ultrarocessed food that you eat per day increases your risk of you eat per day increases your risk of you eat per day increases your risk of dementia by about 13%. So, not only do dementia by about 13%. So, not only do dementia by about 13%. So, not only do we see a long-term increased risk of we see a long-term increased risk of we see a long-term increased risk of dementia, but we also see a change in dementia, but we also see a change in dementia, but we also see a change in terms of your actual performance terms of your actual performance terms of your actual performance dayto-day and your actual decisions that dayto-day and your actual decisions that dayto-day and your actual decisions that you're making. So, it's fairly clear you're making. So, it's fairly clear you're making. So, it's fairly clear that not just in terms of sleep and that not just in terms of sleep and that not just in terms of sleep and exercise, but also diet, we're having exercise, but also diet, we're having exercise, but also diet, we're having direct effects on our ability to perform direct effects on our ability to perform direct effects on our ability to perform in these sorts of situations. in these sorts of situations. in these sorts of situations. >> Do you think we've convinced them? >> Do you think we've convinced them? >> Do you think we've convinced them? >> Probably not. >> Probably not. >> Probably not. >> You almost have to live it. You know, >> You almost have to live it. You know, >> You almost have to live it. You know, it's like one of those things where it's like one of those things where it's like one of those things where like, like, like, >> you know, there's some things like >> you know, there's some things like >> you know, there's some things like people just have to experience before people just have to experience before people just have to experience before they can really believe them. And I feel they can really believe them. And I feel they can really believe them. And I feel this is like because it's so ingrained this is like because it's so ingrained this is like because it's so ingrained in the culture and you see everybody in the culture and you see everybody in the culture and you see everybody doing it. I feel like this might be one doing it. I feel like this might be one doing it. I feel like this might be one of those. of those. of those. >> Yeah, that was true. >> Yeah, that was true. >> Yeah, that was true. >> It's also the case that the uh for most >> It's also the case that the uh for most >> It's also the case that the uh for most people like I guess for a while religion people like I guess for a while religion people like I guess for a while religion was a very motivating force. people

was a very motivating force. people was a very motivating force. people would do anything would do anything would do anything >> to be compliant with their religious >> to be compliant with their religious >> to be compliant with their religious obligations so they could receive the obligations so they could receive the obligations so they could receive the afterlife reward. And people are afterlife reward. And people are afterlife reward. And people are equally, if not more zealous about this equally, if not more zealous about this equally, if not more zealous about this martyrdom culture than people were in martyrdom culture than people were in martyrdom culture than people were in previous religious cultures where the previous religious cultures where the previous religious cultures where the the prize they have to win is is so the prize they have to win is is so the prize they have to win is is so intensely intensely intensely um identified right the status power um identified right the status power um identified right the status power wealth that they're literally willing to wealth that they're literally willing to wealth that they're literally willing to suicide themselves even in a slow mo suicide themselves even in a slow mo suicide themselves even in a slow mo fashion to achieve that prize. It's just fashion to achieve that prize. It's just fashion to achieve that prize. It's just like people are transfixed like people are transfixed like people are transfixed >> in a zombie-like fashion. They don't >> in a zombie-like fashion. They don't >> in a zombie-like fashion. They don't have control over themselves. And that's have control over themselves. And that's have control over themselves. And that's what it seems like to me is like when what it seems like to me is like when what it seems like to me is like when I'm talking to somebody, I'm talking to somebody, I'm talking to somebody, >> I think they can hear these stats of >> I think they can hear these stats of >> I think they can hear these stats of like, you know, it's all like mumbled like, you know, it's all like mumbled like, you know, it's all like mumbled like heart attack risk performance and like heart attack risk performance and like heart attack risk performance and but it's like just background noise, but but it's like just background noise, but but it's like just background noise, but they hear this triumphant anthem of the they hear this triumphant anthem of the they hear this triumphant anthem of the victory of the man in the arena in the victory of the man in the arena in the victory of the man in the arena in the arena, you know, framework. It's like

arena, you know, framework. It's like arena, you know, framework. It's like it's and so I I do in the same way that it's and so I I do in the same way that it's and so I I do in the same way that I guess I I really have reflected a lot I guess I I really have reflected a lot I guess I I really have reflected a lot on my own inability to like the dramatic on my own inability to like the dramatic on my own inability to like the dramatic reduction of my self-control with 11 reduction of my self-control with 11 reduction of my self-control with 11 days of international travel I and and days of international travel I and and days of international travel I and and basically feeling almost powerless to basically feeling almost powerless to basically feeling almost powerless to actually make my own decisions because actually make my own decisions because actually make my own decisions because my body is just destroyed. I'm now in my body is just destroyed. I'm now in my body is just destroyed. I'm now in primitive brain land. I think in many primitive brain land. I think in many primitive brain land. I think in many ways the people who are doing this are ways the people who are doing this are ways the people who are doing this are in some way, shape or form in some kind in some way, shape or form in some kind in some way, shape or form in some kind of deficient state of wisdom where they of deficient state of wisdom where they of deficient state of wisdom where they cannot make good decisions on their own cannot make good decisions on their own cannot make good decisions on their own behalf. It's a really weird behalf. It's a really weird behalf. It's a really weird psychological phenomena. They just don't psychological phenomena. They just don't psychological phenomena. They just don't they don't want to recognize it. They they don't want to recognize it. They they don't want to recognize it. They don't want to square with it andor they don't want to square with it andor they don't want to square with it andor they see it and they're rationally just see it and they're rationally just see it and they're rationally just saying it's the trade-off is worth it to saying it's the trade-off is worth it to saying it's the trade-off is worth it to me. I'd rather just play modern culture me. I'd rather just play modern culture me. I'd rather just play modern culture and pretend like it's not there. It's and pretend like it's not there. It's and pretend like it's not there. It's kind of like it's kind of human nature kind of like it's kind of human nature kind of like it's kind of human nature to some extent to be this to some extent to be this to some extent to be this >> future focused to like like this sense >> future focused to like like this sense >> future focused to like like this sense of delayed gratification which we even

of delayed gratification which we even of delayed gratification which we even teach to children right we teach them teach to children right we teach them teach to children right we teach them delayed gratification and future focus delayed gratification and future focus delayed gratification and future focus and and all these things and it's just and and all these things and it's just and and all these things and it's just taking it's taking them out of presence taking it's taking them out of presence taking it's taking them out of presence right it's taking them out of being in right it's taking them out of being in right it's taking them out of being in like you know the present moment living like you know the present moment living like you know the present moment living in the present moment and that doesn't in the present moment and that doesn't in the present moment and that doesn't need that doesn't need to be like this need that doesn't need to be like this need that doesn't need to be like this woo thing it can also just be like the woo thing it can also just be like the woo thing it can also just be like the idea of like can I be my best self and idea of like can I be my best self and idea of like can I be my best self and also still succeed also still succeed also still succeed in this future moment. Do I have to like in this future moment. Do I have to like in this future moment. Do I have to like go so far as that I'm sacrificing? And I go so far as that I'm sacrificing? And I go so far as that I'm sacrificing? And I think that's that's the issue is that think that's that's the issue is that think that's that's the issue is that it's just being pushed too far. There's it's just being pushed too far. There's it's just being pushed too far. There's nothing wrong with future focusing and nothing wrong with future focusing and nothing wrong with future focusing and delayed gratification. It was just like delayed gratification. It was just like delayed gratification. It was just like you don't have to go crazy about it, you don't have to go crazy about it, you don't have to go crazy about it, right? So I if we're saying that like um right? So I if we're saying that like um right? So I if we're saying that like um we're constantly feature focused and in we're constantly feature focused and in we're constantly feature focused and in the past we were some form of religion the past we were some form of religion the past we were some form of religion focused, we've now swapped that out for focused, we've now swapped that out for focused, we've now swapped that out for status/wealth status/wealth status/wealth money as a religion or as a framework. money as a religion or as a framework. money as a religion or as a framework. And the argument that we're trying to And the argument that we're trying to And the argument that we're trying to make in this call is to swap out health make in this call is to swap out health make in this call is to swap out health as a religion. like make that your as a religion. like make that your as a religion. like make that your number one priority in life for this

number one priority in life for this number one priority in life for this future thinking that Mike's talking future thinking that Mike's talking future thinking that Mike's talking about. And in this transition phase, about. And in this transition phase, about. And in this transition phase, one, you can still earn status, money, one, you can still earn status, money, one, you can still earn status, money, wealth in society and make healthy wealth in society and make healthy wealth in society and make healthy number one priority. We're arguing that. number one priority. We're arguing that. number one priority. We're arguing that. And then two is in this transition And then two is in this transition And then two is in this transition state, it's really painful and very state, it's really painful and very state, it's really painful and very uncomfortable. And if you're feeling uncomfortable. And if you're feeling uncomfortable. And if you're feeling internal angst hearing this conversation internal angst hearing this conversation internal angst hearing this conversation cuz you're like, you guys, like that cuz you're like, you guys, like that cuz you're like, you guys, like that just sounds impossible. There is a way. just sounds impossible. There is a way. just sounds impossible. There is a way. it doesn't need to feel so scary. So, I it doesn't need to feel so scary. So, I it doesn't need to feel so scary. So, I think that's the thing that we need to think that's the thing that we need to think that's the thing that we need to tackle now as a group. tackle now as a group. tackle now as a group. >> Okay, cool. Yeah, it's also the case >> Okay, cool. Yeah, it's also the case >> Okay, cool. Yeah, it's also the case that there's there's probably a few uh that there's there's probably a few uh that there's there's probably a few uh easy bridges here. For example, like easy bridges here. For example, like easy bridges here. For example, like when you look at an Olympic athlete or when you look at an Olympic athlete or when you look at an Olympic athlete or even professional athletes, even professional athletes, even professional athletes, no, very few if anybody argues that it's no, very few if anybody argues that it's no, very few if anybody argues that it's good for an athlete to be sleepd good for an athlete to be sleepd good for an athlete to be sleepd deprived, to not have good nutrition, to deprived, to not have good nutrition, to deprived, to not have good nutrition, to you know, to travel too much. Like it's you know, to travel too much. Like it's you know, to travel too much. Like it's just a an expectation like clearly their just a an expectation like clearly their just a an expectation like clearly their bodies are their primary asset and if bodies are their primary asset and if bodies are their primary asset and if they don't take care of their bodies they don't take care of their bodies they don't take care of their bodies they're not going to perform in the they're not going to perform in the they're not going to perform in the court and they're going to lose. But court and they're going to lose. But court and they're going to lose. But somehow the fact that entrepreneurs or

somehow the fact that entrepreneurs or somehow the fact that entrepreneurs or or professionals generally compete with or professionals generally compete with or professionals generally compete with their minds and their emotions and their their minds and their emotions and their their minds and their emotions and their judgment. They somehow don't view judgment. They somehow don't view judgment. They somehow don't view themselves as subject to the same themselves as subject to the same themselves as subject to the same physical requirements. It's just really physical requirements. It's just really physical requirements. It's just really a a a disconnect of cognition a a a disconnect of cognition a a a disconnect of cognition >> that like we don't pair the two that >> that like we don't pair the two that >> that like we don't pair the two that when you want ideal performance you need when you want ideal performance you need when you want ideal performance you need to treat you need to treat your only to treat you need to treat your only to treat you need to treat your only asset with this kind of um rigorous uh asset with this kind of um rigorous uh asset with this kind of um rigorous uh health approach. So yeah just I think in health approach. So yeah just I think in health approach. So yeah just I think in time I I I do think we are winning the time I I I do think we are winning the time I I I do think we are winning the war. Uh I think that the culture is war. Uh I think that the culture is war. Uh I think that the culture is shifting. I think that people shifting. I think that people shifting. I think that people increasingly see this martyrm culture is increasingly see this martyrm culture is increasingly see this martyrm culture is really bad. it does produce a bad really bad. it does produce a bad really bad. it does produce a bad outcomes and that I I've seen many of my outcomes and that I I've seen many of my outcomes and that I I've seen many of my friends and and um particularly friends and and um particularly friends and and um particularly investors they really care and evaluate investors they really care and evaluate investors they really care and evaluate the founders's health when making an the founders's health when making an the founders's health when making an investment that if the founder is not investment that if the founder is not investment that if the founder is not health forward they second guess their health forward they second guess their health forward they second guess their decisions because they know it just decisions because they know it just decisions because they know it just compromise so I do think we're winning compromise so I do think we're winning compromise so I do think we're winning the war all right cool so let's jump to the war all right cool so let's jump to the war all right cool so let's jump to that so Kate you're saying that people

that so Kate you're saying that people that so Kate you're saying that people are like okay guys look I buy it but are like okay guys look I buy it but are like okay guys look I buy it but you've got to give me an easy on-ramp I you've got to give me an easy on-ramp I you've got to give me an easy on-ramp I can't spend 5 hours a day. So like give can't spend 5 hours a day. So like give can't spend 5 hours a day. So like give me the the argument that this is me the the argument that this is me the the argument that this is actually doable with my my really actually doable with my my really actually doable with my my really intense schedule. intense schedule. intense schedule. >> Yeah. Um and I would put forth first >> Yeah. Um and I would put forth first >> Yeah. Um and I would put forth first this is how I transitioned between the this is how I transitioned between the this is how I transitioned between the two arenas of competition in today's two arenas of competition in today's two arenas of competition in today's world is treating this is like going to world is treating this is like going to world is treating this is like going to sound [ __ ] up but I think it works for sound [ __ ] up but I think it works for sound [ __ ] up but I think it works for people like myself who were people like myself who were people like myself who were indoctrinated into this previous indoctrinated into this previous indoctrinated into this previous mindset. Treat sleep like work. treat it mindset. Treat sleep like work. treat it mindset. Treat sleep like work. treat it like it is a hustle in of itself. So like it is a hustle in of itself. So like it is a hustle in of itself. So when 12 PM rolls around, my desire is to when 12 PM rolls around, my desire is to when 12 PM rolls around, my desire is to stay up and do things because I become stay up and do things because I become stay up and do things because I become very creative during that time period. I very creative during that time period. I very creative during that time period. I love spending that time awake. I have to love spending that time awake. I have to love spending that time awake. I have to delay gratification in that moment and delay gratification in that moment and delay gratification in that moment and say you are working Kate, you need to go say you are working Kate, you need to go say you are working Kate, you need to go to sleep. like that is part of. So in

to sleep. like that is part of. So in to sleep. like that is part of. So in fact like people perceive this at least fact like people perceive this at least fact like people perceive this at least how I perceived it that sleep is a how I perceived it that sleep is a how I perceived it that sleep is a luxury and something that I can that um luxury and something that I can that um luxury and something that I can that um is slacking off to be completely honest. is slacking off to be completely honest. is slacking off to be completely honest. That's definitely how I viewed it. Like That's definitely how I viewed it. Like That's definitely how I viewed it. Like I'm I'm I'm >> I'm relaxing by sleeping. And so if you >> I'm relaxing by sleeping. And so if you >> I'm relaxing by sleeping. And so if you treat it if you're the kind of person treat it if you're the kind of person treat it if you're the kind of person that works 24/7 like I do, I treat now that works 24/7 like I do, I treat now that works 24/7 like I do, I treat now uh sleep as work. So it actually factors uh sleep as work. So it actually factors uh sleep as work. So it actually factors into the, you know, I need to have this into the, you know, I need to have this into the, you know, I need to have this meeting today. I need to have this call meeting today. I need to have this call meeting today. I need to have this call today while also I need to go to sleep today while also I need to go to sleep today while also I need to go to sleep today. And like even when I don't want today. And like even when I don't want today. And like even when I don't want to go to sleep, I have to go to sleep to go to sleep, I have to go to sleep to go to sleep, I have to go to sleep cuz that's my job to actually go to cuz that's my job to actually go to cuz that's my job to actually go to sleep. So like that's the bridge that I sleep. So like that's the bridge that I sleep. So like that's the bridge that I that I I've played in this tricking that I I've played in this tricking that I I've played in this tricking myself. myself. myself. >> Mike, how does that frame land for you? >> Mike, how does that frame land for you? >> Mike, how does that frame land for you? If if Kate says that frame, you know, If if Kate says that frame, you know, If if Kate says that frame, you know, treat sleep like work, does that treat sleep like work, does that treat sleep like work, does that increase does that improve your um increase does that improve your um increase does that improve your um >> anxiety or alone? >> anxiety or alone? >> anxiety or alone? >> Oh, yeah. just like does that does that >> Oh, yeah. just like does that does that >> Oh, yeah. just like does that does that resonate with you? resonate with you? resonate with you? >> Not really. Not really. Like for for me >> Not really. Not really. Like for for me >> Not really. Not really. Like for for me just for me it doesn't. I mean I think

just for me it doesn't. I mean I think just for me it doesn't. I mean I think that like that's it's great that it that like that's it's great that it that like that's it's great that it works for Kate, but for me personally it works for Kate, but for me personally it works for Kate, but for me personally it doesn't as much because doesn't as much because doesn't as much because um yeah I I get a bit I have to be um yeah I I get a bit I have to be um yeah I I get a bit I have to be careful with sleep. Like I get a bit careful with sleep. Like I get a bit careful with sleep. Like I get a bit anxious about sleep if I'm not getting anxious about sleep if I'm not getting anxious about sleep if I'm not getting the sleep that I need. And that leads to the sleep that I need. And that leads to the sleep that I need. And that leads to more lack of sleep, more insomnia. And more lack of sleep, more insomnia. And more lack of sleep, more insomnia. And that's just my my own personal like that's just my my own personal like that's just my my own personal like anxiety stuff that I got to work anxiety stuff that I got to work anxiety stuff that I got to work through. But like calling it work to me through. But like calling it work to me through. But like calling it work to me gives it a um another level of like gives it a um another level of like gives it a um another level of like requirement, you know what I mean? So, requirement, you know what I mean? So, requirement, you know what I mean? So, so for me what for me what actually like so for me what for me what actually like so for me what for me what actually like seems to work better is like um this seems to work better is like um this seems to work better is like um this more like compassionate approach where I more like compassionate approach where I more like compassionate approach where I kind of for me I like depersonalize it kind of for me I like depersonalize it kind of for me I like depersonalize it because there's like there's so much because there's like there's so much because there's like there's so much like self- judgment built up in my own like self- judgment built up in my own like self- judgment built up in my own personal expectations around my own personal expectations around my own personal expectations around my own career and success and all those things career and success and all those things career and success and all those things that I end up treating myself without that I end up treating myself without that I end up treating myself without any um compassion and what I truly need any um compassion and what I truly need any um compassion and what I truly need in order to take care of myself for in order to take care of myself for in order to take care of myself for sleep or for exercise or diet. is just

sleep or for exercise or diet. is just sleep or for exercise or diet. is just more self-compassion. And the way for me more self-compassion. And the way for me more self-compassion. And the way for me to do that is to imagine rather than to do that is to imagine rather than to do that is to imagine rather than making a decision for myself, I'm making making a decision for myself, I'm making making a decision for myself, I'm making like a decision for my child or for a like a decision for my child or for a like a decision for my child or for a cared one or for someone that I can cared one or for someone that I can cared one or for someone that I can easily find that compassion for. easily find that compassion for. easily find that compassion for. >> Like even like when I was a physician >> Like even like when I was a physician >> Like even like when I was a physician working in the ER, how would I want my working in the ER, how would I want my working in the ER, how would I want my doctor to take care of themsel, right? doctor to take care of themsel, right? doctor to take care of themsel, right? As opposed to like should I go to bed As opposed to like should I go to bed As opposed to like should I go to bed right now? It's like well would my right now? It's like well would my right now? It's like well would my patients tomorrow want their doctor to patients tomorrow want their doctor to patients tomorrow want their doctor to go to bed right now? like that sort of go to bed right now? like that sort of go to bed right now? like that sort of like depersonalizes it for me and allows like depersonalizes it for me and allows like depersonalizes it for me and allows me to find the empathy and the me to find the empathy and the me to find the empathy and the compassion that I can't find otherwise compassion that I can't find otherwise compassion that I can't find otherwise just when I'm thinking about like what I just when I'm thinking about like what I just when I'm thinking about like what I should be doing. should be doing. should be doing. >> I'd love that. Yeah. >> I'd love that. Yeah. >> I'd love that. Yeah. >> So, if if I've got this like brutal uh >> So, if if I've got this like brutal uh >> So, if if I've got this like brutal uh you need work 24/7 like turn that into you need work 24/7 like turn that into you need work 24/7 like turn that into sleep mentality and Mike has the empathy sleep mentality and Mike has the empathy sleep mentality and Mike has the empathy route where he's looking after himself route where he's looking after himself route where he's looking after himself as a parent would. How do you do it, as a parent would. How do you do it, as a parent would. How do you do it, Brian? What's your mental model? Yeah, I Brian? What's your mental model? Yeah, I Brian? What's your mental model? Yeah, I think well first of all I think that think well first of all I think that think well first of all I think that there is a group of of people who do there is a group of of people who do there is a group of of people who do really really really feel this they feel the pain and

feel this they feel the pain and feel this they feel the pain and discomfort of the modern culture and discomfort of the modern culture and discomfort of the modern culture and they want an exit path but they feel they want an exit path but they feel they want an exit path but they feel trapped with the expectations of others trapped with the expectations of others trapped with the expectations of others and so I think that's probably the and so I think that's probably the and so I think that's probably the biggest segment. And so I was at a biggest segment. And so I was at a biggest segment. And so I was at a conference cate the conference we were conference cate the conference we were conference cate the conference we were at this past week and there were two at this past week and there were two at this past week and there were two founders there from Australia and I said founders there from Australia and I said founders there from Australia and I said you guys uh and they were talking about you guys uh and they were talking about you guys uh and they were talking about that they basically were doing one that they basically were doing one that they basically were doing one international trip I think every 30 days international trip I think every 30 days international trip I think every 30 days or so you because I guess Australia is or so you because I guess Australia is or so you because I guess Australia is the middle of nowhere. No offense Kate. the middle of nowhere. No offense Kate. the middle of nowhere. No offense Kate. >> It's true. >> It's true. >> It's true. >> So they they you know going to Asia and >> So they they you know going to Asia and >> So they they you know going to Asia and the states it was just a lot and the the states it was just a lot and the the states it was just a lot and the Middle East. And so I was going through Middle East. And so I was going through Middle East. And so I was going through the the devastating uh health effects of the the devastating uh health effects of the the devastating uh health effects of international travel and telling them international travel and telling them international travel and telling them what I had been going through from what I had been going through from what I had been going through from Europe. And one of the founders turned Europe. And one of the founders turned Europe. And one of the founders turned to me and said, "I'm going to tell my to me and said, "I'm going to tell my to me and said, "I'm going to tell my board that Brian Johnson said I can only board that Brian Johnson said I can only board that Brian Johnson said I can only make one international trip each month." make one international trip each month." make one international trip each month." And I said, "That's right. Tell them And I said, "That's right. Tell them And I said, "That's right. Tell them that that your investors do not want you that that your investors do not want you that that your investors do not want you to travel more than one time per month to travel more than one time per month to travel more than one time per month because if you do, it's going to lessen

because if you do, it's going to lessen because if you do, it's going to lessen your performance. It's going to increase your performance. It's going to increase your performance. It's going to increase anxiety, depression. It's going to hurt anxiety, depression. It's going to hurt anxiety, depression. It's going to hurt your relationships. It's going to mess your relationships. It's going to mess your relationships. It's going to mess up your all of your biological systems. up your all of your biological systems. up your all of your biological systems. You will build a better company if you You will build a better company if you You will build a better company if you can create a limited budget of can create a limited budget of can create a limited budget of international travel. Now, if you need international travel. Now, if you need international travel. Now, if you need to make break and do something like two to make break and do something like two to make break and do something like two trips over a 90-day period of time, trips over a 90-day period of time, trips over a 90-day period of time, okay? But just realize there's okay? But just realize there's okay? But just realize there's definitely a budget. It is not an definitely a budget. It is not an definitely a budget. It is not an infinite amount of time you have doing infinite amount of time you have doing infinite amount of time you have doing this. And he I think he really felt this. And he I think he really felt this. And he I think he really felt emboldened in that conversation that if emboldened in that conversation that if emboldened in that conversation that if he had cover like if his investors he had cover like if his investors he had cover like if his investors wanted him to have that kind of wanted him to have that kind of wanted him to have that kind of limitation, you know, if they didn't limitation, you know, if they didn't limitation, you know, if they didn't want him to travel internationally, I want him to travel internationally, I want him to travel internationally, I think he would feel much more empowered. think he would feel much more empowered. think he would feel much more empowered. So to me, it's it's most people want So to me, it's it's most people want So to me, it's it's most people want social permission social permission social permission >> to do the things they know they want to >> to do the things they know they want to >> to do the things they know they want to do. And right now like even the like do. And right now like even the like do. And right now like even the like every I feel like everyone is is every I feel like everyone is is every I feel like everyone is is enslaved by modern society to various enslaved by modern society to various enslaved by modern society to various degrees. I was thinking about this this degrees. I was thinking about this this degrees. I was thinking about this this morning that the the peak existence morning that the the peak existence morning that the the peak existence right now is actually agency. It's the

right now is actually agency. It's the right now is actually agency. It's the ability to be free of entrapment of ability to be free of entrapment of ability to be free of entrapment of various things. And the the forces of various things. And the the forces of various things. And the the forces of the world are so good at entrapping us the world are so good at entrapping us the world are so good at entrapping us with addictive algorithms, addictive with addictive algorithms, addictive with addictive algorithms, addictive foods, addictive social feeds, foods, addictive social feeds, foods, addictive social feeds, addictive, you know, porn like that. The addictive, you know, porn like that. The addictive, you know, porn like that. The world is so good at getting us into world is so good at getting us into world is so good at getting us into these these locked in dopamine uh these these locked in dopamine uh these these locked in dopamine uh addiction cycles. It's entrament. And addiction cycles. It's entrament. And addiction cycles. It's entrament. And once you then are missing out on sleep once you then are missing out on sleep once you then are missing out on sleep and you lose more of your willpower, and you lose more of your willpower, and you lose more of your willpower, that enttrapment becomes stronger and that enttrapment becomes stronger and that enttrapment becomes stronger and stronger to like this strangulation. And stronger to like this strangulation. And stronger to like this strangulation. And people intuitively feel it and they're people intuitively feel it and they're people intuitively feel it and they're mad when they're told that they can't mad when they're told that they can't mad when they're told that they can't they that they should just stop it. It's they that they should just stop it. It's they that they should just stop it. It's like they can't they don't they have no like they can't they don't they have no like they can't they don't they have no more willpower left and the addictions more willpower left and the addictions more willpower left and the addictions are too strong. And so I understand like are too strong. And so I understand like are too strong. And so I understand like >> and so I think it's just giving them >> and so I think it's just giving them >> and so I think it's just giving them permission of like uh hey person like um permission of like uh hey person like um permission of like uh hey person like um >> the people doing this to you need to >> the people doing this to you need to >> the people doing this to you need to stop. Like they're [ __ ] you up. this stop. Like they're [ __ ] you up. this stop. Like they're [ __ ] you up. this is bad for you, it's bad for society, is bad for you, it's bad for society, is bad for you, it's bad for society, but it just that's kind of like the but it just that's kind of like the but it just that's kind of like the wedge because if you put it back on the wedge because if you put it back on the wedge because if you put it back on the person and be like, "Hey person, you person and be like, "Hey person, you person and be like, "Hey person, you must the willpower to do it." It's a must the willpower to do it." It's a must the willpower to do it." It's a really hard equation. If you have if you

really hard equation. If you have if you really hard equation. If you have if you have cover from others who are like, have cover from others who are like, have cover from others who are like, "You know what? We support you in doing "You know what? We support you in doing "You know what? We support you in doing this." It makes it so much easier. this." It makes it so much easier. this." It makes it so much easier. >> So, if someone's like, "Okay, fine. I'll >> So, if someone's like, "Okay, fine. I'll >> So, if someone's like, "Okay, fine. I'll like figure out my mental model." Um, I like figure out my mental model." Um, I like figure out my mental model." Um, I know we always say the same thing. It's know we always say the same thing. It's know we always say the same thing. It's sleep diet exercise sleep diet exercise sleep diet exercise practically. practically. practically. So, can I I'll I'll talk through a So, can I I'll I'll talk through a So, can I I'll I'll talk through a couple ways that like I do this in my couple ways that like I do this in my couple ways that like I do this in my life. life. life. So if someone's listening to this and So if someone's listening to this and So if someone's listening to this and they're like okay how do I actually they're like okay how do I actually they're like okay how do I actually start to implement this one is blocking start to implement this one is blocking start to implement this one is blocking out a morning routine to get things out a morning routine to get things out a morning routine to get things done. So saying like I'm not going to do done. So saying like I'm not going to do done. So saying like I'm not going to do XYZ before this time period. So I think XYZ before this time period. So I think XYZ before this time period. So I think Brian everything on your calendar is Brian everything on your calendar is Brian everything on your calendar is scheduled like after 10 a.m. for scheduled like after 10 a.m. for scheduled like after 10 a.m. for example. Same thing for me. example. Same thing for me. example. Same thing for me. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> And then on the tail end as well. Same >> And then on the tail end as well. Same >> And then on the tail end as well. Same thing for sleep. So when a social event thing for sleep. So when a social event thing for sleep. So when a social event comes up that you've planned in your comes up that you've planned in your comes up that you've planned in your mind like that that time allocation it's mind like that that time allocation it's mind like that that time allocation it's already taken up by default. And then if already taken up by default. And then if already taken up by default. And then if you are going to work around it like you you are going to work around it like you you are going to work around it like you have to plan otherwise as opposed to the have to plan otherwise as opposed to the have to plan otherwise as opposed to the other way around where it's like sleep other way around where it's like sleep other way around where it's like sleep will happen whatever your calendar will happen whatever your calendar will happen whatever your calendar allows for it. So I' say those two allows for it. So I' say those two allows for it. So I' say those two things and then for travel um being

things and then for travel um being things and then for travel um being really really sober about the fact it really really sober about the fact it really really sober about the fact it has and treating it with has and treating it with has and treating it with that level of commitment. So, I know for that level of commitment. So, I know for that level of commitment. So, I know for for Brian and I when we were planning for Brian and I when we were planning for Brian and I when we were planning this Europe trip, I was thinking about this Europe trip, I was thinking about this Europe trip, I was thinking about it like two months in advance being, it like two months in advance being, it like two months in advance being, okay, got to get ready, got to get okay, got to get ready, got to get okay, got to get ready, got to get ready. Like, I need to be mentally in ready. Like, I need to be mentally in ready. Like, I need to be mentally in the right space for this um planning the right space for this um planning the right space for this um planning calendars accordingly. Like, previously, calendars accordingly. Like, previously, calendars accordingly. Like, previously, I would travel red eyes. Um, when I was I would travel red eyes. Um, when I was I would travel red eyes. Um, when I was going back and forth between New York going back and forth between New York going back and forth between New York and LA a lot because I was like, that's and LA a lot because I was like, that's and LA a lot because I was like, that's the best time to get my uh travel out of the best time to get my uh travel out of the best time to get my uh travel out of the way so I have the day to do things. the way so I have the day to do things. the way so I have the day to do things. And now I look back on that I'm like And now I look back on that I'm like And now I look back on that I'm like that is wild that I thought that I was that is wild that I thought that I was that is wild that I thought that I was saving time by traveling overnight. And saving time by traveling overnight. And saving time by traveling overnight. And so same thing for travel like booking so same thing for travel like booking so same thing for travel like booking the plane trip that aligns with your the plane trip that aligns with your the plane trip that aligns with your sleep and morning routine schedule as sleep and morning routine schedule as sleep and morning routine schedule as much as possible. So those are a couple much as possible. So those are a couple much as possible. So those are a couple things that have really worked for me. things that have really worked for me. things that have really worked for me. >> I feel like Brian does a really good job >> I feel like Brian does a really good job >> I feel like Brian does a really good job of this. Um having non-negotiables, of this. Um having non-negotiables, of this. Um having non-negotiables, right? like right? like right? like >> like it is non-negotiable that I am >> like it is non-negotiable that I am >> like it is non-negotiable that I am going to do my whatever 40step morning

going to do my whatever 40step morning going to do my whatever 40step morning routine that takes 3 and 1 half hours or routine that takes 3 and 1 half hours or routine that takes 3 and 1 half hours or whatever whatever crazy thing it is whatever whatever crazy thing it is whatever whatever crazy thing it is right now. right now. right now. >> Sorry, five and a half. Yeah. Like and >> Sorry, five and a half. Yeah. Like and >> Sorry, five and a half. Yeah. Like and my my like wind down routine that takes my my like wind down routine that takes my my like wind down routine that takes you know another hour and a half or you know another hour and a half or you know another hour and a half or whatever it is. But like no I mean but whatever it is. But like no I mean but whatever it is. But like no I mean but in all joking aside like those in all joking aside like those in all joking aside like those non-negotiables are extremely important non-negotiables are extremely important non-negotiables are extremely important because one thing we're really good at because one thing we're really good at because one thing we're really good at doing to ourselves is talking ourselves doing to ourselves is talking ourselves doing to ourselves is talking ourselves out of things, right? So the minute you out of things, right? So the minute you out of things, right? So the minute you give yourself any leeway to convince give yourself any leeway to convince give yourself any leeway to convince yourself that there's an alternative yourself that there's an alternative yourself that there's an alternative that is acceptable, you're going to take that is acceptable, you're going to take that is acceptable, you're going to take it every single time. And that's it every single time. And that's it every single time. And that's especially true in type A people who are especially true in type A people who are especially true in type A people who are like the same people that are very like the same people that are very like the same people that are very successful in life because they they're successful in life because they they're successful in life because they they're very good at arguing and convincing you very good at arguing and convincing you very good at arguing and convincing you of something. And that means they're of something. And that means they're of something. And that means they're good at convincing themselves of good at convincing themselves of good at convincing themselves of something, too. something, too. something, too. >> Yeah. And I think that a lot of people >> Yeah. And I think that a lot of people >> Yeah. And I think that a lot of people when they listen to this, they're going when they listen to this, they're going when they listen to this, they're going to say, "I don't have the luxury of a to say, "I don't have the luxury of a to say, "I don't have the luxury of a morning routine, right? like I'm I'm on morning routine, right? like I'm I'm on morning routine, right? like I'm I'm on calls with Asia, you know, at this time calls with Asia, you know, at this time calls with Asia, you know, at this time of night. I'm on calls with the Middle of night. I'm on calls with the Middle of night. I'm on calls with the Middle East at this time of night. And I've got East at this time of night. And I've got East at this time of night. And I've got blank like so they've got very seriously

blank like so they've got very seriously blank like so they've got very seriously I've got kids who wake up in the I've got kids who wake up in the I've got kids who wake up in the morning. I've got like parents I'm morning. I've got like parents I'm morning. I've got like parents I'm taking care of. Like people have really taking care of. Like people have really taking care of. Like people have really serious life limitations. And so I I get serious life limitations. And so I I get serious life limitations. And so I I get that. And so I guess the question is that. And so I guess the question is that. And so I guess the question is like how how do you um try to create a like how how do you um try to create a like how how do you um try to create a culture of health given that people's culture of health given that people's culture of health given that people's lives are practically very complex and lives are practically very complex and lives are practically very complex and there's no oneizefits-all. And so we I there's no oneizefits-all. And so we I there's no oneizefits-all. And so we I guess like if we review the things we've guess like if we review the things we've guess like if we review the things we've talked about, this is why I like resting talked about, this is why I like resting talked about, this is why I like resting heart rate before bed so much because no heart rate before bed so much because no heart rate before bed so much because no matter who you are, that is the one matter who you are, that is the one matter who you are, that is the one thing you can build life systems around. thing you can build life systems around. thing you can build life systems around. So, like Mike was saying, uh, I try to So, like Mike was saying, uh, I try to So, like Mike was saying, uh, I try to never let myself make decisions because never let myself make decisions because never let myself make decisions because I know if I make a decision in that I know if I make a decision in that I know if I make a decision in that moment, like if it's just like a on the moment, like if it's just like a on the moment, like if it's just like a on the spot, whatever Brian feels like spot, whatever Brian feels like spot, whatever Brian feels like decision, I will most likely make the decision, I will most likely make the decision, I will most likely make the wrong decision. And so you I want like wrong decision. And so you I want like wrong decision. And so you I want like morning Brian, high in willpower, who morning Brian, high in willpower, who morning Brian, high in willpower, who wants good things for myself to be

wants good things for myself to be wants good things for myself to be making system decisions, not 700 p.m. making system decisions, not 700 p.m. making system decisions, not 700 p.m. who's worn down, out of willpower, wants who's worn down, out of willpower, wants who's worn down, out of willpower, wants to soo himself with whatever. And so the to soo himself with whatever. And so the to soo himself with whatever. And so the resting heart rate, you can go back and resting heart rate, you can go back and resting heart rate, you can go back and listen to a previous episode we did on listen to a previous episode we did on listen to a previous episode we did on this on the the ways you can focus on this on the the ways you can focus on this on the the ways you can focus on reducing your heart rate, but very reducing your heart rate, but very reducing your heart rate, but very simple things like a lot of people simple things like a lot of people simple things like a lot of people report that rumination is their number report that rumination is their number report that rumination is their number one problem. So like yesterday, a guy one problem. So like yesterday, a guy one problem. So like yesterday, a guy came over to the house. We I was giving came over to the house. We I was giving came over to the house. We I was giving a bunch of people a tour the other the a bunch of people a tour the other the a bunch of people a tour the other the clinic and he said, "I've done clinic and he said, "I've done clinic and he said, "I've done everything to optimize my health. Like I everything to optimize my health. Like I everything to optimize my health. Like I do red light. I eat my last meal of the do red light. I eat my last meal of the do red light. I eat my last meal of the day four hours before bed. I you know day four hours before bed. I you know day four hours before bed. I you know blank blank and he said I just can't blank blank and he said I just can't blank blank and he said I just can't sleep. And so I was like okay this is a sleep. And so I was like okay this is a sleep. And so I was like okay this is a puzzle. So I probed it around a little puzzle. So I probed it around a little puzzle. So I probed it around a little bit and it's his rumination that he is bit and it's his rumination that he is bit and it's his rumination that he is tip a he is incredibly ambitious. Every tip a he is incredibly ambitious. Every tip a he is incredibly ambitious. Every night before he goes to bed he's like night before he goes to bed he's like night before he goes to bed he's like now how do I you know change the world now how do I you know change the world now how do I you know change the world in this way one or the other. And so I in this way one or the other. And so I in this way one or the other. And so I was like okay so that rumination is was like okay so that rumination is was like okay so that rumination is going to cost you five to 25 beats per going to cost you five to 25 beats per going to cost you five to 25 beats per minute. And so you and you like first of

minute. And so you and you like first of minute. And so you and you like first of all you have to rec reconcile that is all you have to rec reconcile that is all you have to rec reconcile that is not the moment to try to solve the not the moment to try to solve the not the moment to try to solve the world's problems. All right? Like you world's problems. All right? Like you world's problems. All right? Like you need to like separate. So we walk need to like separate. So we walk need to like separate. So we walk through the whole routine of what through the whole routine of what through the whole routine of what rumination is, how you talk through it, rumination is, how you talk through it, rumination is, how you talk through it, how you minimize it is he's going to how you minimize it is he's going to how you minimize it is he's going to report back to me. report back to me. report back to me. I think if if what we should probably do I think if if what we should probably do I think if if what we should probably do is like we should probably bring a few is like we should probably bring a few is like we should probably bring a few guests on here like that so people can guests on here like that so people can guests on here like that so people can hear this dialogue of like what they're hear this dialogue of like what they're hear this dialogue of like what they're going through because in their mind going through because in their mind going through because in their mind they're doing everything right and this they're doing everything right and this they're doing everything right and this like one or two things just slips by and like one or two things just slips by and like one or two things just slips by and undercuts everything else and the bad undercuts everything else and the bad undercuts everything else and the bad sleep leads to poor willpower which has sleep leads to poor willpower which has sleep leads to poor willpower which has other cascade. So I'm guessing that we other cascade. So I'm guessing that we other cascade. So I'm guessing that we can say whatever we want but we probably can say whatever we want but we probably can say whatever we want but we probably just need a few real life examples. just need a few real life examples. just need a few real life examples. >> Good point. Yep. Agreed. >> Good point. Yep. Agreed. >> Good point. Yep. Agreed. >> Mike, by the way, how's your TV series >> Mike, by the way, how's your TV series >> Mike, by the way, how's your TV series The Pit going? The Pit going? The Pit going? I've taken a break. I've taken a break. I've taken a break. I'm taking an extended break. It was uh I'm taking an extended break. It was uh I'm taking an extended break. It was uh I did another one after we had the last I did another one after we had the last I did another one after we had the last podcast and um it crushed me like and podcast and um it crushed me like and podcast and um it crushed me like and >> um I just uh yeah, I took a I'm taking a >> um I just uh yeah, I took a I'm taking a >> um I just uh yeah, I took a I'm taking a break right now. Maybe you get back to break right now. Maybe you get back to break right now. Maybe you get back to it like on Saturday morning or

it like on Saturday morning or it like on Saturday morning or something. something. something. >> On Saturday, I had a minute and I was I >> On Saturday, I had a minute and I was I >> On Saturday, I had a minute and I was I was going to watch the show or something was going to watch the show or something was going to watch the show or something and I searched the pit and I couldn't and I searched the pit and I couldn't and I searched the pit and I couldn't What platform is it on? What platform is it on? What platform is it on? >> It's on Max. Yeah. >> It's on Max. Yeah. >> It's on Max. Yeah. >> Okay. All right. So, I was going to try >> Okay. All right. So, I was going to try >> Okay. All right. So, I was going to try to simulate a Mike Min experience and to simulate a Mike Min experience and to simulate a Mike Min experience and watching The Pit. watching The Pit. watching The Pit. >> What happened? Did you do it? >> What happened? Did you do it? >> What happened? Did you do it? >> No. So, I'll do it this coming weekend. >> No. So, I'll do it this coming weekend. >> No. So, I'll do it this coming weekend. I'll watch an episode. I'll watch an episode. I'll watch an episode. >> So, like that's that's something I need >> So, like that's that's something I need >> So, like that's that's something I need a guardrail around. It's like I my a guardrail around. It's like I my a guardrail around. It's like I my guardrail needs to be I do not watch The guardrail needs to be I do not watch The guardrail needs to be I do not watch The Pit after 6 p.m. or something like that. Pit after 6 p.m. or something like that. Pit after 6 p.m. or something like that. like that's you know like you just like that's you know like you just like that's you know like you just create these guardrails of things that create these guardrails of things that create these guardrails of things that are just non-negotiables that and I are just non-negotiables that and I are just non-negotiables that and I think you know what's interesting is I think you know what's interesting is I think you know what's interesting is I think that that that's like the main think that that that's like the main think that that that's like the main thing for me like when it comes to like thing for me like when it comes to like thing for me like when it comes to like stepping into this world of prioritizing stepping into this world of prioritizing stepping into this world of prioritizing health is just identifying like you know health is just identifying like you know health is just identifying like you know just like the top three five things that just like the top three five things that just like the top three five things that you feel are most important to you and you feel are most important to you and you feel are most important to you and then create those guardrails there's then create those guardrails there's then create those guardrails there's non-negotiables around it and just start non-negotiables around it and just start non-negotiables around it and just start there like that to me like Maybe it's I there like that to me like Maybe it's I there like that to me like Maybe it's I don't eat junk food. Maybe it's I'm in

don't eat junk food. Maybe it's I'm in don't eat junk food. Maybe it's I'm in bed by 10 p.m. Maybe it's, you know, I'm bed by 10 p.m. Maybe it's, you know, I'm bed by 10 p.m. Maybe it's, you know, I'm up an hour before the kids so I can up an hour before the kids so I can up an hour before the kids so I can meditate and journal. Like like whatever meditate and journal. Like like whatever meditate and journal. Like like whatever it is for you that it feels most it is for you that it feels most it is for you that it feels most important to you. And it's probably important to you. And it's probably important to you. And it's probably different for everybody. Like just different for everybody. Like just different for everybody. Like just starting there seems like a really like starting there seems like a really like starting there seems like a really like easy place to get going, you know? easy place to get going, you know? easy place to get going, you know? >> Yeah. I think for people listening, I >> Yeah. I think for people listening, I >> Yeah. I think for people listening, I guess I would try to summarize this guess I would try to summarize this guess I would try to summarize this conversation. I would say this. conversation. I would say this. conversation. I would say this. Don't give up your power. Don't give up your power. Don't give up your power. >> So true. You want you want to >> So true. You want you want to >> So true. You want you want to concentrate your power. You want to be concentrate your power. You want to be concentrate your power. You want to be as powerful as you can as a human. And as powerful as you can as a human. And as powerful as you can as a human. And the best way to be powerful is to claim the best way to be powerful is to claim the best way to be powerful is to claim your agency. And anything that steps on your agency. And anything that steps on your agency. And anything that steps on your power or agency is bad for you. And your power or agency is bad for you. And your power or agency is bad for you. And so that includes if culture is telling so that includes if culture is telling so that includes if culture is telling you to do martyrdom, it's going to ruin you to do martyrdom, it's going to ruin you to do martyrdom, it's going to ruin your power, right? It's going to enslave your power, right? It's going to enslave your power, right? It's going to enslave you in a system that's not your making you in a system that's not your making you in a system that's not your making of not your choice. And it's going to of not your choice. And it's going to of not your choice. And it's going to make you a lesser human being. It's make you a lesser human being. It's make you a lesser human being. It's going to destroy your willpower. It's going to destroy your willpower. It's going to destroy your willpower. It's going to increase your cardiovascular going to increase your cardiovascular going to increase your cardiovascular risk. It's going to make you a less risk. It's going to make you a less risk. It's going to make you a less charismatic leader. It's going to ruin

charismatic leader. It's going to ruin charismatic leader. It's going to ruin your insulin sensitivity. It's going to your insulin sensitivity. It's going to your insulin sensitivity. It's going to you're going to become fat. Like it's you're going to become fat. Like it's you're going to become fat. Like it's just bad. And then just go down the just bad. And then just go down the just bad. And then just go down the list. Do not let the world take your list. Do not let the world take your list. Do not let the world take your power. And that to me is a very clean power. And that to me is a very clean power. And that to me is a very clean statement. Like people understand that statement. Like people understand that statement. Like people understand that people want power, status, and wealth. people want power, status, and wealth. people want power, status, and wealth. So don't lose power. And so that may So don't lose power. And so that may So don't lose power. And so that may resonate, you know. Then also I'd say resonate, you know. Then also I'd say resonate, you know. Then also I'd say second thing is is um be these things second thing is is um be these things second thing is is um be these things because when you be these things when because when you be these things when because when you be these things when you are these things other people will you are these things other people will you are these things other people will see this and they will respond see this and they will respond see this and they will respond correspondingly and when they do you correspondingly and when they do you correspondingly and when they do you have more societal permission to do it. have more societal permission to do it. have more societal permission to do it. If everybody went to bed on time nobody If everybody went to bed on time nobody If everybody went to bed on time nobody would think about it but it's the fact would think about it but it's the fact would think about it but it's the fact that there are some outliers who are that there are some outliers who are that there are some outliers who are like they're so loud of like it's like they're so loud of like it's like they're so loud of like it's amazing and the only way to success to amazing and the only way to success to amazing and the only way to success to you know sleep 3 hours per night they you know sleep 3 hours per night they you know sleep 3 hours per night they that they create this cultural illusion that they create this cultural illusion that they create this cultural illusion that that's what it takes. And so the that that's what it takes. And so the that that's what it takes. And so the more the zeitgeist can shift to this the more the zeitgeist can shift to this the more the zeitgeist can shift to this the the better uh the more cover someone's the better uh the more cover someone's the better uh the more cover someone's going to have. And then three is once going to have. And then three is once going to have. And then three is once you experience this I think you will you experience this I think you will you experience this I think you will feel for yourself you will become a feel for yourself you will become a feel for yourself you will become a better leader. You will become a better better leader. You will become a better better leader. You will become a better entrepreneur a better professional

entrepreneur a better professional entrepreneur a better professional better parent child friend co-orker like better parent child friend co-orker like better parent child friend co-orker like you'll become better at everything you you'll become better at everything you you'll become better at everything you do. You will not have to sacrifice your do. You will not have to sacrifice your do. You will not have to sacrifice your success by doing this. And you just have success by doing this. And you just have success by doing this. And you just have to just just cross over that threshold. to just just cross over that threshold. to just just cross over that threshold. You will realize that and experience it. You will realize that and experience it. You will realize that and experience it. Then you can speak to it with Then you can speak to it with Then you can speak to it with confidence. Okay. I guess as we wrap confidence. Okay. I guess as we wrap confidence. Okay. I guess as we wrap Kate just a quick roundup. You were sick Kate just a quick roundup. You were sick Kate just a quick roundup. You were sick last week. Uh Mike and I missed you. last week. Uh Mike and I missed you. last week. Uh Mike and I missed you. Glad you're back. How are you feeling? Glad you're back. How are you feeling? Glad you're back. How are you feeling? >> I'm feeling much better. Still a little >> I'm feeling much better. Still a little >> I'm feeling much better. Still a little congested, but yeah, definitely. Uh congested, but yeah, definitely. Uh congested, but yeah, definitely. Uh whenever you're sick, it's a always a whenever you're sick, it's a always a whenever you're sick, it's a always a good reminder to be like, take care of good reminder to be like, take care of good reminder to be like, take care of your health cuz when you're sick, you your health cuz when you're sick, you your health cuz when you're sick, you realize how bad it is. So, I'm glad I'm realize how bad it is. So, I'm glad I'm realize how bad it is. So, I'm glad I'm back. back. back. >> And then Kate is going to Croatia and so >> And then Kate is going to Croatia and so >> And then Kate is going to Croatia and so we are concerned about more we are concerned about more we are concerned about more international travel. Uh Kate, can you international travel. Uh Kate, can you international travel. Uh Kate, can you tell us about that? tell us about that? tell us about that? >> Yeah, what do I do about this? I'm going >> Yeah, what do I do about this? I'm going >> Yeah, what do I do about this? I'm going to Croatia for my cousin's wedding. It's to Croatia for my cousin's wedding. It's to Croatia for my cousin's wedding. It's a big deal. I rarely get to celebrate a big deal. I rarely get to celebrate a big deal. I rarely get to celebrate with my Bosnian family. So, it's a big with my Bosnian family. So, it's a big with my Bosnian family. So, it's a big big deal. big deal. big deal. I'm kind of I'm dreading I'm just going I'm kind of I'm dreading I'm just going I'm kind of I'm dreading I'm just going to I'm not going to get sick. I'm going

to I'm not going to get sick. I'm going to I'm not going to get sick. I'm going to avoid that with all to avoid that with all to avoid that with all >> get sick because you're going to listen >> get sick because you're going to listen >> get sick because you're going to listen to the podcast that Brian and I recorded to the podcast that Brian and I recorded to the podcast that Brian and I recorded last week. >> Yeah. What do I do? So, wish me luck. >> Yeah. What do I do? So, wish me luck. >> Yeah. What do I do? So, wish me luck. Well, the good news, Kate, is you are Well, the good news, Kate, is you are Well, the good news, Kate, is you are very well prepared. You now know all the very well prepared. You now know all the very well prepared. You now know all the you have all the evidence on what you you have all the evidence on what you you have all the evidence on what you can do to make the best of the can do to make the best of the can do to make the best of the circumstances. circumstances. circumstances. >> It's true. >> It's true. >> It's true. >> Yeah. Mike, um, how are you doing in >> Yeah. Mike, um, how are you doing in >> Yeah. Mike, um, how are you doing in life? life? life? >> I'm pretty great. Um, I'm not traveling >> I'm pretty great. Um, I'm not traveling >> I'm pretty great. Um, I'm not traveling a lot right now, which is amazing for my a lot right now, which is amazing for my a lot right now, which is amazing for my sleep, and I'm not watching The Pit, sleep, and I'm not watching The Pit, sleep, and I'm not watching The Pit, which is also amazing for my sleep. So, which is also amazing for my sleep. So, which is also amazing for my sleep. So, yeah, things are things are good. yeah, things are things are good. yeah, things are things are good. >> So, you're you're in a nice steady >> So, you're you're in a nice steady >> So, you're you're in a nice steady routine. You're feeling good. routine. You're feeling good. routine. You're feeling good. >> Yeah. This will inevitably not last for >> Yeah. This will inevitably not last for >> Yeah. This will inevitably not last for very long, but uh going to try to enjoy very long, but uh going to try to enjoy very long, but uh going to try to enjoy it while it's here. it while it's here. it while it's here. >> Yeah, those those durations where you're >> Yeah, those those durations where you're >> Yeah, those those durations where you're at home in a routine consistency are the at home in a routine consistency are the at home in a routine consistency are the best. best. best. >> That's the best, isn't it? Yeah. >> That's the best, isn't it? Yeah. >> That's the best, isn't it? Yeah. >> Brian, um any observations lately about >> Brian, um any observations lately about >> Brian, um any observations lately about your health that you want to slip in? your health that you want to slip in? your health that you want to slip in? Like I'm just seeing red light therapy

Like I'm just seeing red light therapy Like I'm just seeing red light therapy before bed experiment. before bed experiment. before bed experiment. >> A few quick ticks. You can see on my >> A few quick ticks. You can see on my >> A few quick ticks. You can see on my face that my face is pretty destroyed. face that my face is pretty destroyed. face that my face is pretty destroyed. On Friday, I did a 1927 nanometer laser. On Friday, I did a 1927 nanometer laser. On Friday, I did a 1927 nanometer laser. This is Lutronic. So, this is a This is Lutronic. So, this is a This is Lutronic. So, this is a nonablative laser. So, we're trying to nonablative laser. So, we're trying to nonablative laser. So, we're trying to basically rebuild collagen, elastin, basically rebuild collagen, elastin, basically rebuild collagen, elastin, lessen wrinkles. Um, and so this is like lessen wrinkles. Um, and so this is like lessen wrinkles. Um, and so this is like we shaved off maybe 30% of my face with we shaved off maybe 30% of my face with we shaved off maybe 30% of my face with this. I had numbing cream on, but it's this. I had numbing cream on, but it's this. I had numbing cream on, but it's still pretty spicy. Um, and then I did I still pretty spicy. Um, and then I did I still pretty spicy. Um, and then I did I started doing red light therapy before started doing red light therapy before started doing red light therapy before bed. Uh, this is the math. Uh, the bed. Uh, this is the math. Uh, the bed. Uh, this is the math. Uh, the approximation we have is the lights are approximation we have is the lights are approximation we have is the lights are 4 jewels cime squared per minute. So I 4 jewels cime squared per minute. So I 4 jewels cime squared per minute. So I increased my time to 8 minutes. I'm increased my time to 8 minutes. I'm increased my time to 8 minutes. I'm getting 32 jewels per centimeter squared getting 32 jewels per centimeter squared getting 32 jewels per centimeter squared of red and near exposure before bed. My of red and near exposure before bed. My of red and near exposure before bed. My first night of experiment, it increased first night of experiment, it increased first night of experiment, it increased my sleep duration by an hour. So a huge my sleep duration by an hour. So a huge my sleep duration by an hour. So a huge boost. We'll see over time what happens. boost. We'll see over time what happens. boost. We'll see over time what happens. And then I would say that I'm still And then I would say that I'm still And then I would say that I'm still recovering from travel. Like it I'm recovering from travel. Like it I'm recovering from travel. Like it I'm still trying to get my sleep

still trying to get my sleep still trying to get my sleep architecture on point. I'm still trying architecture on point. I'm still trying architecture on point. I'm still trying to get all my body system back online. I to get all my body system back online. I to get all my body system back online. I think people when I talk about this, think people when I talk about this, think people when I talk about this, people are like, "Oh, you're such a people are like, "Oh, you're such a people are like, "Oh, you're such a snowflake." And they like they I think snowflake." And they like they I think snowflake." And they like they I think when you feel like [ __ ] you don't feel when you feel like [ __ ] you don't feel when you feel like [ __ ] you don't feel more shitty. Uh you you don't feel the more shitty. Uh you you don't feel the more shitty. Uh you you don't feel the shittyness as much. When you feel shittyness as much. When you feel shittyness as much. When you feel exceptional and you go to bad, man, it exceptional and you go to bad, man, it exceptional and you go to bad, man, it stings. So, I'm really like I'm just in stings. So, I'm really like I'm just in stings. So, I'm really like I'm just in this I'm in a recoil phase of just how this I'm in a recoil phase of just how this I'm in a recoil phase of just how bad and devastating international travel bad and devastating international travel bad and devastating international travel is for health. And there's we have a few is for health. And there's we have a few is for health. And there's we have a few clinics in China opening up and our clinics in China opening up and our clinics in China opening up and our China team is wanting us to be out in China team is wanting us to be out in China team is wanting us to be out in China this fall. And man, I China this fall. And man, I China this fall. And man, I I don't know how to do it. But um trying I don't know how to do it. But um trying I don't know how to do it. But um trying to figure out like what we do on the to figure out like what we do on the to figure out like what we do on the international front. We were also going international front. We were also going international front. We were also going to do a Middle East trip. Um so yeah, to do a Middle East trip. Um so yeah, to do a Middle East trip. Um so yeah, trying to figure that out. trying to figure that out. trying to figure that out. >> All right, you guys. Love hanging out >> All right, you guys. Love hanging out >> All right, you guys. Love hanging out with you. with you. with you. >> Good to see you guys. Okay, guys. Be >> Good to see you guys. Okay, guys. Be >> Good to see you guys. Okay, guys. Be well. Bye. well. Bye. well. Bye. >> This is the Brian Johnson podcast.

>> This is the Brian Johnson podcast. >> This is the Brian Johnson podcast. Special thanks to my co-hosts, Kate Special thanks to my co-hosts, Kate Special thanks to my co-hosts, Kate Tollo and Dr. Mike Malin. For more Tollo and Dr. Mike Malin. For more Tollo and Dr. Mike Malin. For more science breakdowns and protocols, science breakdowns and protocols, science breakdowns and protocols, subscribe to my YouTube channel, follow subscribe to my YouTube channel, follow subscribe to my YouTube channel, follow the podcast on your favorite platform, the podcast on your favorite platform, the podcast on your favorite platform, or follow me on Instagram or ex Brian