Discussion on Sauna Cold Plunge Benefits How to Best Use Them with Dr Leo Runnin
00:00[Music] [Music] hello everybody it's uh my inv body hello everybody it's uh my inv body hello everybody it's uh my inv body Marathon show here um I'm your host Dr Marathon show here um I'm your host Dr Marathon show here um I'm your host Dr Leo coric and I'm a sports chiropractor Leo coric and I'm a sports chiropractor Leo coric and I'm a sports chiropractor and to my left here is Matt pisanelli and to my left here is Matt pisanelli and to my left here is Matt pisanelli he's also a sports caropractor and to my he's also a sports caropractor and to my he's also a sports caropractor and to my right is Zack Zachary goule Zachariah right is Zack Zachary goule Zachariah right is Zack Zachary goule Zachariah Zachariah he's a massage therapist here Zachariah he's a massage therapist here Zachariah he's a massage therapist here at the clinic as well um and yeah at the clinic as well um and yeah at the clinic as well um and yeah today's show we're going to just talk a today's show we're going to just talk a today's show we're going to just talk a little bit about like modalities um little bit about like modalities um little bit about like modalities um isolating heat and cold like Sona work isolating heat and cold like Sona work isolating heat and cold like Sona work cold plunges and and just kind of some cold plunges and and just kind of some cold plunges and and just kind of some some tips about that and how to utilize some tips about that and how to utilize some tips about that and how to utilize that in your your daily routine um so that in your your daily routine um so that in your your daily routine um so kind of to start you know Sona and Co kind of to start you know Sona and Co kind of to start you know Sona and Co plunges has been something that's been a plunges has been something that's been a plunges has been something that's been a foundation of patient management at the foundation of patient management at the foundation of patient management at the clinic for about a decade now and we've
01:00clinic for about a decade now and we've clinic for about a decade now and we've obviously becoming very trendy now obviously becoming very trendy now obviously becoming very trendy now especially the cold plunges and especially the cold plunges and especially the cold plunges and everything and it's something that we everything and it's something that we everything and it's something that we have always sort of agreed with and and have always sort of agreed with and and have always sort of agreed with and and believed in and um so it's fun for us to believed in and um so it's fun for us to believed in and um so it's fun for us to see it catch fire but we we've had have see it catch fire but we we've had have see it catch fire but we we've had have been doing this for for years but I kind been doing this for for years but I kind been doing this for for years but I kind of feel like we're GNA start a little of feel like we're GNA start a little of feel like we're GNA start a little bit with Dr Matt here because um he's bit with Dr Matt here because um he's bit with Dr Matt here because um he's just now starting to do a little bit just now starting to do a little bit just now starting to do a little bit more of the son work he didn't really do more of the son work he didn't really do more of the son work he didn't really do a ton of it before but he's trying to do a ton of it before but he's trying to do a ton of it before but he's trying to do a little heat adaptation but we'll talk a little heat adaptation but we'll talk a little heat adaptation but we'll talk kind of about all the benefits of kind of about all the benefits of kind of about all the benefits of everything here but we'll kind of start everything here but we'll kind of start everything here but we'll kind of start with that yeah so just to kind of start with that yeah so just to kind of start with that yeah so just to kind of start basically I history-wise I do horrible basically I history-wise I do horrible basically I history-wise I do horrible in the heat I've never been any type of in the heat I've never been any type of in the heat I've never been any type of Runner who enjoys being in the hot so Runner who enjoys being in the hot so Runner who enjoys being in the hot so you're a grizzly bear out side running you're a grizzly bear out side running you're a grizzly bear out side running oh yeah like I sweat horribly I I just oh yeah like I sweat horribly I I just oh yeah like I sweat horribly I I just hate the heat so usually spring training hate the heat so usually spring training hate the heat so usually spring training is best for me and then once we get into is best for me and then once we get into is best for me and then once we get into fall training it's pretty awful um so fall training it's pretty awful um so fall training it's pretty awful um so I've got a couple big races coming up
02:00I've got a couple big races coming up I've got a couple big races coming up this fall that I'm doing and I want to this fall that I'm doing and I want to this fall that I'm doing and I want to try and get past that so so okay so what try and get past that so so okay so what try and get past that so so okay so what is that what are you doing yeah so is that what are you doing yeah so is that what are you doing yeah so starting off um some research that starting off um some research that starting off um some research that basically shows that heat training uh basically shows that heat training uh basically shows that heat training uh allows you to adapt uh so you want to allows you to adapt uh so you want to allows you to adapt uh so you want to stress yourself in a hotter environment stress yourself in a hotter environment stress yourself in a hotter environment so uh we have the privilege of two times so uh we have the privilege of two times so uh we have the privilege of two times a week where I can run during basically a week where I can run during basically a week where I can run during basically the hottest part of the day so I'm the hottest part of the day so I'm the hottest part of the day so I'm taking advantage of that starting out um taking advantage of that starting out um taking advantage of that starting out um at home I've been cranking up the heat a at home I've been cranking up the heat a at home I've been cranking up the heat a couple more degrees my wife absolutely couple more degrees my wife absolutely couple more degrees my wife absolutely hates it right now I sleep typically in hates it right now I sleep typically in hates it right now I sleep typically in you know a long sleeve shirt and pants you know a long sleeve shirt and pants you know a long sleeve shirt and pants as well just trying to get my my Core as well just trying to get my my Core as well just trying to get my my Core Body up just baking all day all Body up just baking all day all Body up just baking all day all day that's not something I would I would day that's not something I would I would day that's not something I would I would choose to do yeah man that sounds choose to do yeah man that sounds choose to do yeah man that sounds miserable well I miserable well I miserable well I mean but we always joked like when I mean but we always joked like when I mean but we always joked like when I when I first got out of um uh undergrad when I first got out of um uh undergrad when I first got out of um uh undergrad I remember I ran um a race in the middle
03:00I remember I ran um a race in the middle I remember I ran um a race in the middle of the summer and I got my teeth kicked of the summer and I got my teeth kicked of the summer and I got my teeth kicked in by a bunch of Africans that were in by a bunch of Africans that were in by a bunch of Africans that were really really good bunch of kenyons that really really good bunch of kenyons that really really good bunch of kenyons that were really fast and they um it was in were really fast and they um it was in were really fast and they um it was in the summer it was in July and I remember the summer it was in July and I remember the summer it was in July and I remember thinking man like how in the world are thinking man like how in the world are thinking man like how in the world are they able to run that fast in the Heat they able to run that fast in the Heat they able to run that fast in the Heat and this was like Circa 2007 is and then and this was like Circa 2007 is and then and this was like Circa 2007 is and then I a couple weeks later or like a month I a couple weeks later or like a month I a couple weeks later or like a month and a half later I run a Labor Day race and a half later I run a Labor Day race and a half later I run a Labor Day race and and and I beat a lot of them like a couple of I beat a lot of them like a couple of I beat a lot of them like a couple of them beat me but I beat the majority them beat me but I beat the majority them beat me but I beat the majority that beat me down at this other race and that beat me down at this other race and that beat me down at this other race and the only thing that was different was the only thing that was different was the only thing that was different was the temperature was like 20 degrees the temperature was like 20 degrees the temperature was like 20 degrees cooler and I was like ah I don't know cooler and I was like ah I don't know cooler and I was like ah I don't know how to run in the Heat and it's clearly how to run in the Heat and it's clearly how to run in the Heat and it's clearly an issue and and it's my fitness was an issue and and it's my fitness was an issue and and it's my fitness was actually should have been worse in the actually should have been worse in the actually should have been worse in the second race so then I literally was just second race so then I literally was just second race so then I literally was just cooling down with them and just talking cooling down with them and just talking cooling down with them and just talking about it and they're like oh yeah we about it and they're like oh yeah we about it and they're like oh yeah we just like literally run in our Fela just like literally run in our Fela just like literally run in our Fela outfits the whole time like we just outfits the whole time like we just outfits the whole time like we just basically heat train constantly and so basically heat train constantly and so basically heat train constantly and so then I always joked it's like Poor Man's
04:00then I always joked it's like Poor Man's then I always joked it's like Poor Man's altitude training you know the running altitude training you know the running altitude training you know the running in the heat is like literally like in the heat is like literally like in the heat is like literally like training like you're in like out training like you're in like out training like you're in like out altitude the benefits are the exact same altitude the benefits are the exact same altitude the benefits are the exact same you're going to get increase in blood you're going to get increase in blood you're going to get increase in blood volume and um you want to explain why volume and um you want to explain why volume and um you want to explain why that happens yeah so like basically that happens yeah so like basically that happens yeah so like basically whenever the simple mechanism is that whenever the simple mechanism is that whenever the simple mechanism is that whenever you're in a hot environment you whenever you're in a hot environment you whenever you're in a hot environment you have to your body puts out a stimulus to have to your body puts out a stimulus to have to your body puts out a stimulus to get blood to the surface uh to the get blood to the surface uh to the get blood to the surface uh to the extremities and the surface of the skin extremities and the surface of the skin extremities and the surface of the skin quicker so it increases capillarization quicker so it increases capillarization quicker so it increases capillarization in the in the blood vessels or in the in in the in the blood vessels or in the in in the in the blood vessels or in the in the body so which means you're going to the body so which means you're going to the body so which means you're going to get more um surface area that your blood get more um surface area that your blood get more um surface area that your blood can travel through so it can distribute can travel through so it can distribute can travel through so it can distribute Heat against um the skin and then that's Heat against um the skin and then that's Heat against um the skin and then that's how you cool yourself off obviously you how you cool yourself off obviously you how you cool yourself off obviously you do that by sweating but if you get more do that by sweating but if you get more do that by sweating but if you get more blood vessels towards the skin uh itself blood vessels towards the skin uh itself blood vessels towards the skin uh itself then you can cool off quicker now then you can cool off quicker now then you can cool off quicker now altitude training works by increasing altitude training works by increasing altitude training works by increasing hemoglobin based on the the decrease in hemoglobin based on the the decrease in hemoglobin based on the the decrease in oxygen but the effect is you increase oxygen but the effect is you increase oxygen but the effect is you increase your blood volume because you can't you your blood volume because you can't you your blood volume because you can't you can't thicken your blood with excess
05:00can't thicken your blood with excess can't thicken your blood with excess hemoglobin so that's how you get hemoglobin so that's how you get hemoglobin so that's how you get increase in blood volume but it doesn't increase in blood volume but it doesn't increase in blood volume but it doesn't adapt you actually to the heat so it adapt you actually to the heat so it adapt you actually to the heat so it behooves you actually to he to actually behooves you actually to he to actually behooves you actually to he to actually heat train because that makes you more heat train because that makes you more heat train because that makes you more efficient in performing in the Heat and efficient in performing in the Heat and efficient in performing in the Heat and also gives you the same blood V blood also gives you the same blood V blood also gives you the same blood V blood volume benefits um the other side effect volume benefits um the other side effect volume benefits um the other side effect that's really interesting with that's really interesting with that's really interesting with performance is that if you increase your performance is that if you increase your performance is that if you increase your capillarization that means that you have capillarization that means that you have capillarization that means that you have more miles of blood vessel in your more miles of blood vessel in your more miles of blood vessel in your system now that means you can whenever system now that means you can whenever system now that means you can whenever you get lactic acid production for you get lactic acid production for you get lactic acid production for muscles now you have a larger surface muscles now you have a larger surface muscles now you have a larger surface area to distribute that lactic acid so area to distribute that lactic acid so area to distribute that lactic acid so you feel the effects less it's actually you feel the effects less it's actually you feel the effects less it's actually kind of amazing how that works um but kind of amazing how that works um but kind of amazing how that works um but what's funny is you can do this with SAA what's funny is you can do this with SAA what's funny is you can do this with SAA work so just even doing like you know work so just even doing like you know work so just even doing like you know using the SAA a couple days a week or using the SAA a couple days a week or using the SAA a couple days a week or like a half hour will essentially mimic like a half hour will essentially mimic like a half hour will essentially mimic like a double in running and um like a double in running and um like a double in running and um obviously will do the same thing you're obviously will do the same thing you're obviously will do the same thing you're going to get the Boost in blood volume going to get the Boost in blood volume going to get the Boost in blood volume and you know there's all sorts of other and you know there's all sorts of other and you know there's all sorts of other benefits though dude remember um
06:00benefits though dude remember um benefits though dude remember um can we name drop on this sure V Von can we name drop on this sure V Von can we name drop on this sure V Von Steen yeah a couple years ago so van is Steen yeah a couple years ago so van is Steen yeah a couple years ago so van is a ultramarathon a ultramarathon a ultramarathon runner in Ohio and he qualified for runner in Ohio and he qualified for runner in Ohio and he qualified for Western States 100 and he was in Western States 100 and he was in Western States 100 and he was in the Master's age group he was that year the Master's age group he was that year the Master's age group he was that year he was the oldest finisher which was 21 he was the oldest finisher which was 21 he was the oldest finisher which was 21 or 22 Yeah he was the oldest finisher at or 22 Yeah he was the oldest finisher at or 22 Yeah he was the oldest finisher at Western States and he um he would do his Western States and he um he would do his Western States and he um he would do his training runs and then come here training runs and then come here training runs and then come here and getting the sauna and I think he did and getting the sauna and I think he did and getting the sauna and I think he did that what like two or three days a week that what like two or three days a week that what like two or three days a week yeah and when he came back and he was I yeah and when he came back and he was I yeah and when he came back and he was I think it was like what him and like think it was like what him and like think it was like what him and like three or four other guys I can't three or four other guys I can't three or four other guys I can't remember but he was the top finisher and remember but he was the top finisher and remember but he was the top finisher and I think the two or three other guys like I think the two or three other guys like I think the two or three other guys like dnfed and then maybe one other guy dnfed and then maybe one other guy dnfed and then maybe one other guy finished but he attributed it to coming finished but he attributed it to coming finished but he attributed it to coming to the sauna yeah it's like dude you're to the sauna yeah it's like dude you're to the sauna yeah it's like dude you're running a 100 miles and the sauna is the running a 100 miles and the sauna is the running a 100 miles and the sauna is the thing that like the other thing that's thing that like the other thing that's thing that like the other thing that's really interesting is that when you when really interesting is that when you when really interesting is that when you when you integrate s work into your routine you integrate s work into your routine you integrate s work into your routine and we'll discover a little bit more and we'll discover a little bit more and we'll discover a little bit more here in a second about what different
07:00here in a second about what different here in a second about what different types of sauna but if you integrate it types of sauna but if you integrate it types of sauna but if you integrate it into your routine you will literally into your routine you will literally into your routine you will literally recover quicker so not only is there the recover quicker so not only is there the recover quicker so not only is there the performance benefit there's the recovery performance benefit there's the recovery performance benefit there's the recovery aspect because it just has to go down to aspect because it just has to go down to aspect because it just has to go down to um activating heat shock proteins so um activating heat shock proteins so um activating heat shock proteins so heat shock proteins are um basically heat shock proteins are um basically heat shock proteins are um basically epigenetic modifiers that will epigenetic modifiers that will epigenetic modifiers that will manipulate the genome to make you more manipulate the genome to make you more manipulate the genome to make you more efficient with recovery and also like efficient with recovery and also like efficient with recovery and also like life it it sort of activates life life it it sort of activates life life it it sort of activates life sustaining genes and that's the really sustaining genes and that's the really sustaining genes and that's the really The Genius of of the the heat therapy The Genius of of the the heat therapy The Genius of of the the heat therapy yeah so so like when when yeah so so like when when yeah so so like when when would would would like based off of like a training like based off of like a training like based off of like a training program Would You Do heat training in program Would You Do heat training in program Would You Do heat training in sauna after like a hard workout after an sauna after like a hard workout after an sauna after like a hard workout after an easy run after long like or does it easy run after long like or does it easy run after long like or does it really ma like does it really matter is really ma like does it really matter is really ma like does it really matter is it just kind of integrate it when it it just kind of integrate it when it it just kind of integrate it when it yeah I think it matters I think it yeah I think it matters I think it yeah I think it matters I think it matters because you know if you did a matters because you know if you did a matters because you know if you did a really hard like say you did a long run
08:00really hard like say you did a long run really hard like say you did a long run you ran just like 15 20 miles I probably you ran just like 15 20 miles I probably you ran just like 15 20 miles I probably wouldn't do it that day I mean that's wouldn't do it that day I mean that's wouldn't do it that day I mean that's just too much stress in the system I just too much stress in the system I just too much stress in the system I mean it's like the risk of mean it's like the risk of mean it's like the risk of dehydration extended dehydration you dehydration extended dehydration you dehydration extended dehydration you know because you're just going to be know because you're just going to be know because you're just going to be it's just too too much but you know say it's just too too much but you know say it's just too too much but you know say you do like quarters and then the you do like quarters and then the you do like quarters and then the workout in total was like maybe eight 10 workout in total was like maybe eight 10 workout in total was like maybe eight 10 miles like you could do it then that's miles like you could do it then that's miles like you could do it then that's that's fine um but say you do quarters that's fine um but say you do quarters that's fine um but say you do quarters in in in July in the middle of the day well I July in the middle of the day well I July in the middle of the day well I probably wouldn't do the SAA after that probably wouldn't do the SAA after that probably wouldn't do the SAA after that but it bur be put at the end of most but it bur be put at the end of most but it bur be put at the end of most days um and I think that's that's days um and I think that's that's days um and I think that's that's beneficial which kind of brings up uh an beneficial which kind of brings up uh an beneficial which kind of brings up uh an important point about the stimulus on important point about the stimulus on important point about the stimulus on when to do it so typically my role of when to do it so typically my role of when to do it so typically my role of thumb with managing people is that it's thumb with managing people is that it's thumb with managing people is that it's best to do heat training later in the best to do heat training later in the best to do heat training later in the day um typically after 5 because not day um typically after 5 because not day um typically after 5 because not that it's bad in the morning or anything that it's bad in the morning or anything that it's bad in the morning or anything but you're going to get a better effect but you're going to get a better effect but you're going to get a better effect if it's later and it's it really has to if it's later and it's it really has to if it's later and it's it really has to do with how you are doing when you're do with how you are doing when you're do with how you are doing when you're heading into bed because you want your heading into bed because you want your heading into bed because you want your body actively trying to cool itself down
09:00body actively trying to cool itself down body actively trying to cool itself down as it's heading into bed and the as it's heading into bed and the as it's heading into bed and the reasoning on that is you will um you'll reasoning on that is you will um you'll reasoning on that is you will um you'll sleep deeper because when your core body sleep deeper because when your core body sleep deeper because when your core body temperature drops that's really what temperature drops that's really what temperature drops that's really what gets you into REM sleep it's not really gets you into REM sleep it's not really gets you into REM sleep it's not really the timing or the cycle of the sun it's the timing or the cycle of the sun it's the timing or the cycle of the sun it's actually the heat that does it yeah so actually the heat that does it yeah so actually the heat that does it yeah so it's typically two to three degrees it's typically two to three degrees it's typically two to three degrees below your normal temperature you're below your normal temperature you're below your normal temperature you're 98.6 degrees which is the average 98.6 degrees which is the average 98.6 degrees which is the average temperature it would be somewhere temperature it would be somewhere temperature it would be somewhere between 95 and 96 is the optimal between 95 and 96 is the optimal between 95 and 96 is the optimal temperature for your body to be at temperature for your body to be at temperature for your body to be at night and when you're sleeping when night and when you're sleeping when night and when you're sleeping when you're sleeping and then upon waking you're sleeping and then upon waking you're sleeping and then upon waking your body naturally will start to your body naturally will start to your body naturally will start to elevate it again yeah and so you know elevate it again yeah and so you know elevate it again yeah and so you know because of that if you do Sona work because of that if you do Sona work because of that if you do Sona work right at the beginning when you first right at the beginning when you first right at the beginning when you first wake up you you're already going to be wake up you you're already going to be wake up you you're already going to be elevating your body too high yeah yeah elevating your body too high yeah yeah elevating your body too high yeah yeah so it's not that it's bad but it's less so it's not that it's bad but it's less so it's not that it's bad but it's less effective yeah you know it's still a effective yeah you know it's still a effective yeah you know it's still a great stimulus but if you're going to do great stimulus but if you're going to do great stimulus but if you're going to do it like you might as well just do it at it like you might as well just do it at it like you might as well just do it at the end of the day so that way you get a the end of the day so that way you get a the end of the day so that way you get a better night's sleep and then um you better night's sleep and then um you better night's sleep and then um you know you're really s that boost and
10:00know you're really s that boost and know you're really s that boost and blood volume throughout the night and blood volume throughout the night and blood volume throughout the night and then just activating those genes but on then just activating those genes but on then just activating those genes but on the flip side um if that's the case then the flip side um if that's the case then the flip side um if that's the case then you probably shouldn't do a lot of cold you probably shouldn't do a lot of cold you probably shouldn't do a lot of cold exposure after five because obviously exposure after five because obviously exposure after five because obviously you want your core body temperature to you want your core body temperature to you want your core body temperature to be slowing down as you head into sleep be slowing down as you head into sleep be slowing down as you head into sleep so if you get into cold that would be so if you get into cold that would be so if you get into cold that would be ramping it up so I wouldn't take like ramping it up so I wouldn't take like ramping it up so I wouldn't take like cold showers before bed or you know I cold showers before bed or you know I cold showers before bed or you know I wouldn't I wouldn't do any of that it's wouldn't I wouldn't do any of that it's wouldn't I wouldn't do any of that it's right it's the reason why like right it's the reason why like right it's the reason why like historically you know people were in the historically you know people were in the historically you know people were in the day with a hot bath I mean it just you day with a hot bath I mean it just you day with a hot bath I mean it just you you will sleep better if you have a you will sleep better if you have a you will sleep better if you have a really hot bath or you have a sauna really hot bath or you have a sauna really hot bath or you have a sauna experience or really hot shower right experience or really hot shower right experience or really hot shower right before bed you're just going to sleep before bed you're just going to sleep before bed you're just going to sleep better um cold exposure is better in the better um cold exposure is better in the better um cold exposure is better in the morning because and and sort of the morning because and and sort of the morning because and and sort of the early afternoon sort of thing because it early afternoon sort of thing because it early afternoon sort of thing because it stimulates you you know it wakes you up stimulates you you know it wakes you up stimulates you you know it wakes you up it it integrates you it like gets you it it integrates you it like gets you it it integrates you it like gets you live and and your brain is very clear live and and your brain is very clear live and and your brain is very clear after that and so it's a great stimulus after that and so it's a great stimulus after that and so it's a great stimulus as the before the day sort of as the before the day sort of as the before the day sort of starts Matt so with you sleeping in a starts Matt so with you sleeping in a starts Matt so with you sleeping in a long sleeve t-shirt at night are you long sleeve t-shirt at night are you long sleeve t-shirt at night are you going to try to keep that routine
11:00going to try to keep that routine going to try to keep that routine through the summer when you're through the summer when you're through the summer when you're training I haven't thought about that training I haven't thought about that training I haven't thought about that yet yet yet because I because I because I didn't do that on purpose but it kind of didn't do that on purpose but it kind of didn't do that on purpose but it kind of happened last happened last happened last summer and I felt like it backfired on summer and I felt like it backfired on summer and I felt like it backfired on me I mean definitely could like so what me I mean definitely could like so what me I mean definitely could like so what I mean by that is um when I was training I mean by that is um when I was training I mean by that is um when I was training for Burning River I would like not put for Burning River I would like not put for Burning River I would like not put the AC on in my car for I mean I would the AC on in my car for I mean I would the AC on in my car for I mean I would do it sometimes but like most of the do it sometimes but like most of the do it sometimes but like most of the time I didn't have my AC on because I time I didn't have my AC on because I time I didn't have my AC on because I was trying to adapt and then train and was trying to adapt and then train and was trying to adapt and then train and then also like my room can be like an then also like my room can be like an then also like my room can be like an oven at points during the day and so oven at points during the day and so oven at points during the day and so when I went into burning River I went in when I went into burning River I went in when I went into burning River I went in super tired and part of the reason was super tired and part of the reason was super tired and part of the reason was that our upstairs as we have AC in our that our upstairs as we have AC in our that our upstairs as we have AC in our house it doesn't get good circulation up house it doesn't get good circulation up house it doesn't get good circulation up in our bedroom and I was never like in our bedroom and I was never like in our bedroom and I was never like cooling down yeah I was just always hot cooling down yeah I was just always hot cooling down yeah I was just always hot and so I felt like that back fired and so I felt like that back fired and so I felt like that back fired towards the end because I never felt
12:00towards the end because I never felt towards the end because I never felt tapered so I bought I bought an AC unit tapered so I bought I bought an AC unit tapered so I bought I bought an AC unit for my window yeah I don't think I would for my window yeah I don't think I would for my window yeah I don't think I would do it so close to like like I'll do it so close to like like I'll do it so close to like like I'll probably this is my last week of going probably this is my last week of going probably this is my last week of going into it so I have a race in two weeks into it so I have a race in two weeks into it so I have a race in two weeks I'm I'm gonna give myself a complete I'm I'm gonna give myself a complete I'm I'm gonna give myself a complete week of not doing any heat training just week of not doing any heat training just week of not doing any heat training just to get get yeah are you just gonna tape to get get yeah are you just gonna tape to get get yeah are you just gonna tape cold packs to your body no I'm not cold packs to your body no I'm not cold packs to your body no I'm not gonna no so basically I am doing s work gonna no so basically I am doing s work gonna no so basically I am doing s work I'm doing s work five days a week yeah I'm doing s work five days a week yeah I'm doing s work five days a week yeah um you're using it at the clinic yeah so um you're using it at the clinic yeah so um you're using it at the clinic yeah so so at our Clinic we have um an infrared so at our Clinic we have um an infrared so at our Clinic we have um an infrared sauna which brings up a good topic and sauna which brings up a good topic and sauna which brings up a good topic and then there's the the other kind of sauna then there's the the other kind of sauna then there's the the other kind of sauna is a traditional finish um the infrared is a traditional finish um the infrared is a traditional finish um the infrared is a good experience for somebody like is a good experience for somebody like is a good experience for somebody like you yeah oh grizzly bear and that's not you yeah oh grizzly bear and that's not you yeah oh grizzly bear and that's not used to the infrared doesn't get nearly used to the infrared doesn't get nearly used to the infrared doesn't get nearly as hot goes to about 160 degrees Yeah as hot goes to about 160 degrees Yeah as hot goes to about 160 degrees Yeah but it does penetrate I think probably
13:00but it does penetrate I think probably but it does penetrate I think probably yeah the experience is more pleasant and yeah the experience is more pleasant and yeah the experience is more pleasant and it's sort of it's a little bit more like it's sort of it's a little bit more like it's sort of it's a little bit more like a microwave versus like a convection a microwave versus like a convection a microwave versus like a convection oven um it kind of gets you a little oven um it kind of gets you a little oven um it kind of gets you a little deeper because the infrared Rays kind of deeper because the infrared Rays kind of deeper because the infrared Rays kind of go through your body um so yeah it only go through your body um so yeah it only go through your body um so yeah it only gets up to about 160 at Max whereas a gets up to about 160 at Max whereas a gets up to about 160 at Max whereas a traditional finish is going to go 180 to traditional finish is going to go 180 to traditional finish is going to go 180 to 200 degrees and then yeah you can make 200 degrees and then yeah you can make 200 degrees and then yeah you can make that pretty nightmarishly hot with the that pretty nightmarishly hot with the that pretty nightmarishly hot with the with the with the Steam and but what's with the with the Steam and but what's with the with the Steam and but what's also nice too with the infrared is that also nice too with the infrared is that also nice too with the infrared is that you get time of training over a longer you get time of training over a longer you get time of training over a longer period of time whereas like in a period of time whereas like in a period of time whereas like in a traditional like um SAA where it's like traditional like um SAA where it's like traditional like um SAA where it's like a steam SAA or something like that a steam SAA or something like that a steam SAA or something like that you're really only going to be in it for you're really only going to be in it for you're really only going to be in it for you know five to 15 maybe 20 minutes you know five to 15 maybe 20 minutes you know five to 15 maybe 20 minutes whereas I'm spending about an hour in it whereas I'm spending about an hour in it whereas I'm spending about an hour in it yeah all of the main research that comes yeah all of the main research that comes yeah all of the main research that comes out of Finland which is the bulk of the out of Finland which is the bulk of the out of Finland which is the bulk of the SAA research basically says that 20 to SAA research basically says that 20 to SAA research basically says that 20 to 30 minutes 180 degrees four to five days 30 minutes 180 degrees four to five days 30 minutes 180 degrees four to five days a week perfect like that's like spoton a week perfect like that's like spoton a week perfect like that's like spoton um not every day but four to five days a um not every day but four to five days a
14:00um not every day but four to five days a week and that's the stimulus now what week and that's the stimulus now what week and that's the stimulus now what Matt's basically saying is that like Matt's basically saying is that like Matt's basically saying is that like when you do the infrared you can go when you do the infrared you can go when you do the infrared you can go longer you can go 45 minutes an hour and longer you can go 45 minutes an hour and longer you can go 45 minutes an hour and it and it's actually very comfortable in it and it's actually very comfortable in it and it's actually very comfortable in there in fact in the sauna we have here there in fact in the sauna we have here there in fact in the sauna we have here you just you can just watch TV you know you just you can just watch TV you know you just you can just watch TV you know you watch movies and stuff and yeah walk you watch movies and stuff and yeah walk you watch movies and stuff and yeah walk by and Matt's he's watching Pulp Fiction by and Matt's he's watching Pulp Fiction by and Matt's he's watching Pulp Fiction all the time of course of course he is all the time of course of course he is all the time of course of course he is so you know that's kind of the that's so you know that's kind of the that's so you know that's kind of the that's kind of the what goes on there but um kind of the what goes on there but um kind of the what goes on there but um you know I think uh I what I personally you know I think uh I what I personally you know I think uh I what I personally like to do is I like I have a a fin one like to do is I like I have a a fin one like to do is I like I have a a fin one at home and so I'll do that uh 45 days a at home and so I'll do that uh 45 days a at home and so I'll do that uh 45 days a week no not 45 two to three days a week week no not 45 two to three days a week week no not 45 two to three days a week and then when I head it towards a race and then when I head it towards a race and then when I head it towards a race though what I'll do is actually the though what I'll do is actually the though what I'll do is actually the infrared one because the infrared infrared one because the infrared infrared one because the infrared wavelengths will give you more energy wavelengths will give you more energy wavelengths will give you more energy because it stimulates the mitochondria because it stimulates the mitochondria because it stimulates the mitochondria in the body so it's then less about the in the body so it's then less about the in the body so it's then less about the heat even though you're still kind of heat even though you're still kind of heat even though you're still kind of doing a little bit of heat exposure but doing a little bit of heat exposure but doing a little bit of heat exposure but more about like ramping up the internal more about like ramping up the internal more about like ramping up the internal energy and just getting the internal energy and just getting the internal energy and just getting the internal combustion ready to go for the race and combustion ready to go for the race and combustion ready to go for the race and then like Matt was saying it like right then like Matt was saying it like right then like Matt was saying it like right before the race you sort of P out pull
15:00before the race you sort of P out pull before the race you sort of P out pull out the rip cord and you don't do heat out the rip cord and you don't do heat out the rip cord and you don't do heat training for about a weekish and then training for about a weekish and then training for about a weekish and then just kind of let your body kind of coast just kind of let your body kind of coast just kind of let your body kind of coast in maybe doing a couple light sessions in maybe doing a couple light sessions in maybe doing a couple light sessions but definitely not the couple days prior but definitely not the couple days prior but definitely not the couple days prior to the main effort so I need to write to the main effort so I need to write to the main effort so I need to write this stuff down yeah yeah or just ask this stuff down yeah yeah or just ask this stuff down yeah yeah or just ask me well you guys are talking about it me well you guys are talking about it me well you guys are talking about it now I need to write it now I need to write it now I need to write it down yeah so that's kind of the way to down yeah so that's kind of the way to down yeah so that's kind of the way to do with the with heat stuff and I and I do with the with heat stuff and I and I do with the with heat stuff and I and I you know like I said there's a just a you know like I said there's a just a you know like I said there's a just a massive amount of benefits um to it but massive amount of benefits um to it but massive amount of benefits um to it but I think you know some people even like I think you know some people even like I think you know some people even like now what's kind of becoming a little bit now what's kind of becoming a little bit now what's kind of becoming a little bit more trendy is working out in the saas more trendy is working out in the saas more trendy is working out in the saas which people do like push-ups and which people do like push-ups and which people do like push-ups and sit-ups and stuff yeah that seems fun sit-ups and stuff yeah that seems fun sit-ups and stuff yeah that seems fun yeah that also seems yeah that also seems yeah that also seems miserable have you done it at all like miserable have you done it at all like miserable have you done it at all like done sit-ups or push-ups in there no done sit-ups or push-ups in there no done sit-ups or push-ups in there no squats it it it spikes pretty quick man squats it it it spikes pretty quick man squats it it it spikes pretty quick man yeah it does I think I did it one time yeah it does I think I did it one time yeah it does I think I did it one time and I would like I did like a set of 10 and I would like I did like a set of 10 and I would like I did like a set of 10 of like just air squats off the table of like just air squats off the table of like just air squats off the table that's in there or or the bench I mean that's in there or or the bench I mean that's in there or or the bench I mean and I was like no no I'm just gonna and I was like no no I'm just gonna and I was like no no I'm just gonna chill here the other thing that's really
16:00chill here the other thing that's really chill here the other thing that's really interesting about um SAA work is that interesting about um SAA work is that interesting about um SAA work is that cupping in the sauna actually is pretty cupping in the sauna actually is pretty cupping in the sauna actually is pretty awesome oh I didn't even think of that awesome oh I didn't even think of that awesome oh I didn't even think of that that's a good one you know when you cup that's a good one you know when you cup that's a good one you know when you cup you want to get a good effect for like you want to get a good effect for like you want to get a good effect for like myof fual cupping where you get that big myof fual cupping where you get that big myof fual cupping where you get that big deep R red look you want the tissue to deep R red look you want the tissue to deep R red look you want the tissue to be warm because the acids that bathe the be warm because the acids that bathe the be warm because the acids that bathe the fascia are they're hyaluronic acids and fascia are they're hyaluronic acids and fascia are they're hyaluronic acids and they they're very sensitive to they they're very sensitive to they they're very sensitive to temperature so if you increase the temperature so if you increase the temperature so if you increase the temperature your core body temperature temperature your core body temperature temperature your core body temperature like in the sauna you're going to get a like in the sauna you're going to get a like in the sauna you're going to get a nasty deep release in cupping like so if nasty deep release in cupping like so if nasty deep release in cupping like so if you like cup your thighs which is like you like cup your thighs which is like you like cup your thighs which is like obviously easy to just do like because obviously easy to just do like because obviously easy to just do like because you're just sitting there like you're you're just sitting there like you're you're just sitting there like you're gonna like look like you're battered gonna like look like you're battered gonna like look like you're battered it's like really I'm gonna have to try it's like really I'm gonna have to try it's like really I'm gonna have to try that next time because I would do that that next time because I would do that that next time because I would do that all the time for my achilles because all the time for my achilles because all the time for my achilles because that's usually what I get is Achilles that's usually what I get is Achilles that's usually what I get is Achilles issues so I would like cup all the time issues so I would like cup all the time issues so I would like cup all the time my achilles when I'm in the sauna and my achilles when I'm in the sauna and my achilles when I'm in the sauna and sometimes I would get to good of a sometimes I would get to good of a sometimes I would get to good of a release sometimes I would actually like release sometimes I would actually like release sometimes I would actually like get them too loose and it would almost get them too loose and it would almost get them too loose and it would almost like flare them up but anyway that's F like flare them up but anyway that's F like flare them up but anyway that's F yeah it's a fun thing you did that at
17:00yeah it's a fun thing you did that at yeah it's a fun thing you did that at home yeah the home one yeah where'd you home yeah the home one yeah where'd you home yeah the home one yeah where'd you have it at 190 it gets up there my wife have it at 190 it gets up there my wife have it at 190 it gets up there my wife hates being in the sauna with me because hates being in the sauna with me because hates being in the sauna with me because I would just keep pouring water on it I would just keep pouring water on it I would just keep pouring water on it and like at times you pour water on the and like at times you pour water on the and like at times you pour water on the sa and you just wait and then and then sa and you just wait and then and then sa and you just wait and then and then it just gets your skin and just burns it just gets your skin and just burns it just gets your skin and just burns you you're like you gota be that guy you you you're like you gota be that guy you you you're like you gota be that guy you gota be that guy I make it so miserable gota be that guy I make it so miserable gota be that guy I make it so miserable so I annoy my daughter and my wife all so I annoy my daughter and my wife all so I annoy my daughter and my wife all the time like they hate going in the SAA the time like they hate going in the SAA the time like they hate going in the SAA with me just don't put your cuffs by the with me just don't put your cuffs by the with me just don't put your cuffs by the heating element they'll melt for sure heating element they'll melt for sure heating element they'll melt for sure yeah your cups is that you said the myal yeah your cups is that you said the myal yeah your cups is that you said the myal oh yeah yeah no this is like literally oh yeah yeah no this is like literally oh yeah yeah no this is like literally like and and you can't even come close like and and you can't even come close like and and you can't even come close to that thing so pretty awesome other to that thing so pretty awesome other to that thing so pretty awesome other things that you would suggest for people things that you would suggest for people things that you would suggest for people to do at home for heat training that if to do at home for heat training that if to do at home for heat training that if they don't have access to a sa yeah um they don't have access to a sa yeah um they don't have access to a sa yeah um so yeah I think like like you were so yeah I think like like you were so yeah I think like like you were talking about just gener raising the the talking about just gener raising the the talking about just gener raising the the heat of your workout room or the heat of heat of your workout room or the heat of heat of your workout room or the heat of the house and things like that I think the house and things like that I think the house and things like that I think is important um the obvious answer would
18:00is important um the obvious answer would is important um the obvious answer would be uh warm shower nice bath um a nice be uh warm shower nice bath um a nice be uh warm shower nice bath um a nice bath not an ice bath but a but a nice bath not an ice bath but a but a nice bath not an ice bath but a but a nice warm bath and then um I I personally warm bath and then um I I personally warm bath and then um I I personally wouldn't advise somebody to wear a lot wouldn't advise somebody to wear a lot wouldn't advise somebody to wear a lot of clothes going in a bed I would only of clothes going in a bed I would only of clothes going in a bed I would only do that if you're like sick and you're do that if you're like sick and you're do that if you're like sick and you're just trying to like you know yeah just just trying to like you know yeah just just trying to like you know yeah just kind of get a fever out and you kind of get a fever out and you kind of get a fever out and you something like that it's essentially something like that it's essentially something like that it's essentially what a fever is trying to do is trying what a fever is trying to do is trying what a fever is trying to do is trying to burn out the microbes so if you kind to burn out the microbes so if you kind to burn out the microbes so if you kind of feel a little bug coming on then of feel a little bug coming on then of feel a little bug coming on then that's a good idea um I have it at home that's a good idea um I have it at home that's a good idea um I have it at home I've been trying to tell people for I've been trying to tell people for I've been trying to tell people for years my routine for when I get sick a years my routine for when I get sick a years my routine for when I get sick a gallon of water some gallon of water some gallon of water some Pedialite hoodie sweatpants keep it on Pedialite hoodie sweatpants keep it on Pedialite hoodie sweatpants keep it on all night you're you're knocking that all night you're you're knocking that all night you're you're knocking that out in like a day a day and a half no out in like a day a day and a half no out in like a day a day and a half no one ever does it because they don't like one ever does it because they don't like one ever does it because they don't like to be hot at night yeah they take it off to be hot at night yeah they take it off to be hot at night yeah they take it off right but you're done I'm telling you right but you're done I'm telling you right but you're done I'm telling you just do it yeah lean into the fever you just do it yeah lean into the fever you just do it yeah lean into the fever you know obviously like be smart about it know obviously like be smart about it know obviously like be smart about it but you know that's kind of the general but you know that's kind of the general but you know that's kind of the general C so I know that there's some resarch C so I know that there's some resarch C so I know that there's some resarch that shows that if you take a warm
19:00that shows that if you take a warm that shows that if you take a warm shower right after exercise it will shower right after exercise it will shower right after exercise it will prolong like how long you stay warm I prolong like how long you stay warm I prolong like how long you stay warm I agree with that it it's pretty agree with that it it's pretty agree with that it it's pretty significant like 10% increase I think significant like 10% increase I think significant like 10% increase I think that's pretty cool no that's that's a that's pretty cool no that's that's a that's pretty cool no that's that's a really smart move yeah what about so really smart move yeah what about so really smart move yeah what about so Zack you're the coold guy you're doing Zack you're the coold guy you're doing Zack you're the coold guy you're doing cold plunges for a long time for a cold plunges for a long time for a cold plunges for a long time for a little bit Yeah tell me about like where little bit Yeah tell me about like where little bit Yeah tell me about like where you at with that stuff yeah um it's you at with that stuff yeah um it's you at with that stuff yeah um it's getting back to a routine of it I've getting back to a routine of it I've getting back to a routine of it I've been um I'll be honest with you I been um I'll be honest with you I been um I'll be honest with you I probably haven't been doing it as much probably haven't been doing it as much probably haven't been doing it as much as I would like to and it's not so much as I would like to and it's not so much as I would like to and it's not so much that I don't want to do it it's just that I don't want to do it it's just that I don't want to do it it's just I'll be honest I've been lazy I've just I'll be honest I've been lazy I've just I'll be honest I've been lazy I've just been lazy yeah but I love it no I I been lazy yeah but I love it no I I been lazy yeah but I love it no I I absolutely love it so um I started doing absolutely love it so um I started doing absolutely love it so um I started doing it probably two years ago um I just it probably two years ago um I just it probably two years ago um I just finally like ripped the Band-Aid off and finally like ripped the Band-Aid off and finally like ripped the Band-Aid off and was like dude I just want to see what was like dude I just want to see what was like dude I just want to see what this is all about like I bought a cold this is all about like I bought a cold this is all about like I bought a cold plunge for home it was like a blowup plunge for home it was like a blowup plunge for home it was like a blowup thing had it in the backyard by like the thing had it in the backyard by like the thing had it in the backyard by like the end of October and me and my end of October and me and my end of October and me and my brother-in-law were um because he brother-in-law were um because he brother-in-law were um because he because he bought one too and we just
20:00because he bought one too and we just because he bought one too and we just were like dude we're doing it every day were like dude we're doing it every day were like dude we're doing it every day like just every day we're getting in and like just every day we're getting in and like just every day we're getting in and it didn't matter what time it was and I it didn't matter what time it was and I it didn't matter what time it was and I really enjoyed it like I I felt my like really enjoyed it like I I felt my like really enjoyed it like I I felt my like my mental state was so much calmer my mental state was so much calmer my mental state was so much calmer throughout my day like nothing really throughout my day like nothing really throughout my day like nothing really bothered me yeah um I felt like like bothered me yeah um I felt like like bothered me yeah um I felt like like truly I felt like my energy level was truly I felt like my energy level was truly I felt like my energy level was really spiked um obviously my recovery really spiked um obviously my recovery really spiked um obviously my recovery from like my day-to-day work felt better from like my day-to-day work felt better from like my day-to-day work felt better like shoulder was feeling better back like shoulder was feeling better back like shoulder was feeling better back was feeling better but was feeling better but was feeling better but yeah I just really enjoyed it but the yeah I just really enjoyed it but the yeah I just really enjoyed it but the thing that I think the next year because thing that I think the next year because thing that I think the next year because I didn't do it as much was the after I didn't do it as much was the after I didn't do it as much was the after effect was the effect of like because I effect was the effect of like because I effect was the effect of like because I shiver and I go cold turkey like I'm all shiver and I go cold turkey like I'm all shiver and I go cold turkey like I'm all in like I don't shower afterwards like I in like I don't shower afterwards like I in like I don't shower afterwards like I would just like get out and like let would just like get out and like let would just like get out and like let myself just naturally come back up to my myself just naturally come back up to my myself just naturally come back up to my temperature and dude it D the first time temperature and dude it D the first time temperature and dude it D the first time I did it because I had to like work to I did it because I had to like work to I did it because I had to like work to it but the first time I did it dude I it but the first time I did it dude I it but the first time I did it dude I shivered for like two hours I actually shivered for like two hours I actually shivered for like two hours I actually made my I gave myself a like I got sick made my I gave myself a like I got sick made my I gave myself a like I got sick from it from it from it like the next day I woke up I was like I
21:00like the next day I woke up I was like I like the next day I woke up I was like I like oh gosh like I'm stuffy I don't like oh gosh like I'm stuffy I don't like oh gosh like I'm stuffy I don't feel good bud you like back spasms and feel good bud you like back spasms and feel good bud you like back spasms and stuff because you're shivering so much stuff because you're shivering so much stuff because you're shivering so much but dude after that it's like I broke a but dude after that it's like I broke a but dude after that it's like I broke a wall and yeah now even though like if I wall and yeah now even though like if I wall and yeah now even though like if I do it like like if I do it let's say on do it like like if I do it let's say on do it like like if I do it let's say on like a Wednesday or something like a like a Wednesday or something like a like a Wednesday or something like a random day and then I wait two weeks or random day and then I wait two weeks or random day and then I wait two weeks or like I wait a year I I'll I won't get in like I wait a year I I'll I won't get in like I wait a year I I'll I won't get in the shower and I'll still warm back up the shower and I'll still warm back up the shower and I'll still warm back up within like 30 to 45 minutes yeah but within like 30 to 45 minutes yeah but within like 30 to 45 minutes yeah but it's just like that period where I'm it's just like that period where I'm it's just like that period where I'm like oh do you do much of it how long um like oh do you do much of it how long um like oh do you do much of it how long um well to answer your question I haven't well to answer your question I haven't well to answer your question I haven't for a while for a while for a while uh mainly because we haven't put ice in uh mainly because we haven't put ice in uh mainly because we haven't put ice in ours um I love the cold you know cold ours um I love the cold you know cold ours um I love the cold you know cold plunges I do really well with them it plunges I do really well with them it plunges I do really well with them it takes me about 20 seconds to acclimate takes me about 20 seconds to acclimate takes me about 20 seconds to acclimate to it and I can go in there for that's to it and I can go in there for that's to it and I can go in there for that's the grizzly bear that's all that chest the grizzly bear that's all that chest the grizzly bear that's all that chest are doesn't you're like a polar bear no are doesn't you're like a polar bear no are doesn't you're like a polar bear no it really is true I during the during it really is true I during the during it really is true I during the during the winter I could run with just shorts the winter I could run with just shorts the winter I could run with just shorts on off does and we're in Ohio so that's on off does and we're in Ohio so that's on off does and we're in Ohio so that's a big deal yeah yeah so um for me I
22:00a big deal yeah yeah so um for me I a big deal yeah yeah so um for me I pretty much take a cold shower every day pretty much take a cold shower every day pretty much take a cold shower every day in the morning yeah pretty much every in the morning yeah pretty much every in the morning yeah pretty much every single day and I don't start I don't single day and I don't start I don't single day and I don't start I don't start with heat I just start at Cold my start with heat I just start at Cold my start with heat I just start at Cold my wife starts with heat and she kind of wife starts with heat and she kind of wife starts with heat and she kind of goes into it but um I I just go straight goes into it but um I I just go straight goes into it but um I I just go straight cold and then it literally never gets cold and then it literally never gets cold and then it literally never gets easy for me like I am so much better easy for me like I am so much better easy for me like I am so much better with heat than I am with cold like I how with heat than I am with cold like I how with heat than I am with cold like I how do you approach it when how do you do you approach it when how do you do you approach it when how do you approach your shower approach your shower approach your shower I don't think about it did you okay I don't think about it did you okay I don't think about it did you okay actually okay so let me do this so I actually okay so let me do this so I actually okay so let me do this so I have a Tesla so before I go have a Tesla so before I go have a Tesla so before I go in this is like the majority of my work in this is like the majority of my work in this is like the majority of my work days I will turn on the Tesla on the days I will turn on the Tesla on the days I will turn on the Tesla on the highest temperature yeah and then I just highest temperature yeah and then I just highest temperature yeah and then I just think about how in like 15 minutes once think about how in like 15 minutes once think about how in like 15 minutes once I'm dressed and ready to go I'll be in a I'm dressed and ready to go I'll be in a I'm dressed and ready to go I'll be in a warm Tesla do you put it don't they have warm Tesla do you put it don't they have warm Tesla do you put it don't they have like that romance mode on on the put like that romance mode on on the put like that romance mode on on the put on which is basically get the little on which is basically get the little on which is basically get the little fire fire fire so I actually do that I get it ready to
23:00so I actually do that I get it ready to so I actually do that I get it ready to go so that when I get in my Tesla no go so that when I get in my Tesla no go so that when I get in my Tesla no matter if it's summer or winter or matter if it's summer or winter or matter if it's summer or winter or whatever I'm just like I'm like looking whatever I'm just like I'm like looking whatever I'm just like I'm like looking forward to that but I just do it just forward to that but I just do it just forward to that but I just do it just get right in do you go like chest and get right in do you go like chest and get right in do you go like chest and then because I because I have like you then because I because I have like you then because I because I have like you go ahead for okay good because that's go ahead for okay good because that's go ahead for okay good because that's what I was gonna say because I used to what I was gonna say because I used to what I was gonna say because I used to go chest and then then I would like hit go chest and then then I would like hit go chest and then then I would like hit my back and I'd like yeah but now I go my back and I'd like yeah but now I go my back and I'd like yeah but now I go head first and now it's like it makes it head first and now it's like it makes it head first and now it's like it makes it so much easier shock on the head which I so much easier shock on the head which I so much easier shock on the head which I know that there is science behind that know that there is science behind that know that there is science behind that but I I can't remember it yeah um but I but I I can't remember it yeah um but I but I I can't remember it yeah um but I know like it like well it's your brain know like it like well it's your brain know like it like well it's your brain stem yeah yeah your brain stems at the stem yeah yeah your brain stems at the stem yeah yeah your brain stems at the back of the neck I've always done back back of the neck I've always done back back of the neck I've always done back first and then it's the chest that gets first and then it's the chest that gets first and then it's the chest that gets it for me I'm like yeah yeah the brain it for me I'm like yeah yeah the brain it for me I'm like yeah yeah the brain stem is a big deal and then um part of stem is a big deal and then um part of stem is a big deal and then um part of the reason why the chest is a big deal the reason why the chest is a big deal the reason why the chest is a big deal is because most people don't most people is because most people don't most people is because most people don't most people don't have a lot of like white fat on don't have a lot of like white fat on don't have a lot of like white fat on the chest which brings up a good point the chest which brings up a good point the chest which brings up a good point so you mentioned earlier about um having so you mentioned earlier about um having so you mentioned earlier about um having increased uh energy after doing a lot of increased uh energy after doing a lot of increased uh energy after doing a lot of it and that's sort of a hidden effect of it and that's sort of a hidden effect of it and that's sort of a hidden effect of cold plunges is that one you will and
24:00cold plunges is that one you will and cold plunges is that one you will and we're talking about like so we're we're talking about like so we're we're talking about like so we're talking about cold exposure so there's talking about cold exposure so there's talking about cold exposure so there's the showers which is fine but it's the showers which is fine but it's the showers which is fine but it's better to do a cold plunge there's also better to do a cold plunge there's also better to do a cold plunge there's also like the cryo Chambers but I'm actually like the cryo Chambers but I'm actually like the cryo Chambers but I'm actually kind of mid on those because they're kind of mid on those because they're kind of mid on those because they're like why spend all that money to just like why spend all that money to just like why spend all that money to just get blasted with liquid nitrogen when get blasted with liquid nitrogen when get blasted with liquid nitrogen when you could just literally take a cold you could just literally take a cold you could just literally take a cold shower which research shows is basically shower which research shows is basically shower which research shows is basically identical to it but cold plunge is the identical to it but cold plunge is the identical to it but cold plunge is the best and it's because water pulls the best and it's because water pulls the best and it's because water pulls the heat off of your skin quicker so just heat off of your skin quicker so just heat off of your skin quicker so just think of like the contact of like a think of like the contact of like a think of like the contact of like a liquid nitrogen on you like if you're in liquid nitrogen on you like if you're in liquid nitrogen on you like if you're in a chamber that the gas on your skin is a chamber that the gas on your skin is a chamber that the gas on your skin is much less contact like the surface area much less contact like the surface area much less contact like the surface area contact is less right so it can't pull contact is less right so it can't pull contact is less right so it can't pull the heat off of your skin which is the heat off of your skin which is the heat off of your skin which is essentially what it's trying to do um essentially what it's trying to do um essentially what it's trying to do um but if you have water if you're but if you have water if you're but if you have water if you're submerged in water almost every single submerged in water almost every single submerged in water almost every single of your skin cells is in contact with of your skin cells is in contact with of your skin cells is in contact with water so the water will pull the heat water so the water will pull the heat water so the water will pull the heat off of your skin and it just drastically off of your skin and it just drastically off of your skin and it just drastically cools you down the less effect of that
25:00cools you down the less effect of that cools you down the less effect of that would be the the the shower because would be the the the shower because would be the the the shower because there's less obvious water on your skin there's less obvious water on your skin there's less obvious water on your skin so that's the change there but showers so that's the change there but showers so that's the change there but showers can for me at least seem worse because can for me at least seem worse because can for me at least seem worse because you have more of a flow so it takes the you have more of a flow so it takes the you have more of a flow so it takes the heat away faster but not as a bulk yeah heat away faster but not as a bulk yeah heat away faster but not as a bulk yeah like well I think also too like well I think also too like well I think also too psychologically showers are harder psychologically showers are harder psychologically showers are harder because you could literally just turn because you could literally just turn because you could literally just turn the dial is true and then you have like the dial is true and then you have like the dial is true and then you have like you have Serenity like inches away from you have Serenity like inches away from you have Serenity like inches away from your from you but if you had like a cold your from you but if you had like a cold your from you but if you had like a cold plunge where you could then just put plunge where you could then just put plunge where you could then just put like something to spin the that makes it like something to spin the that makes it like something to spin the that makes it so much worse oh it's so much worse yeah so much worse oh it's so much worse yeah so much worse oh it's so much worse yeah so like if you're in a coal plunge and so like if you're in a coal plunge and so like if you're in a coal plunge and you shake and move like you realize how you shake and move like you realize how you shake and move like you realize how bad that is because the the the shell of bad that is because the the the shell of bad that is because the the the shell of water that's on your skin got warm water that's on your skin got warm water that's on your skin got warm because it pulled the warm off your skin because it pulled the warm off your skin because it pulled the warm off your skin which is what cooled you down um so once which is what cooled you down um so once which is what cooled you down um so once you move you obviously shake that up and you move you obviously shake that up and you move you obviously shake that up and then you have to recreate a new shell so then you have to recreate a new shell so then you have to recreate a new shell so obviously the whirlpool cold plunges are obviously the whirlpool cold plunges are obviously the whirlpool cold plunges are the worst thing and for me because I the worst thing and for me because I the worst thing and for me because I hate cold but but it's actually the most hate cold but but it's actually the most hate cold but but it's actually the most therapeutic thing for you it's like the
26:00therapeutic thing for you it's like the therapeutic thing for you it's like the best and generally speaking you want the best and generally speaking you want the best and generally speaking you want the temperature to be I don't know in the temperature to be I don't know in the temperature to be I don't know in the 40s right so yeah 40s I mean I don't 40s right so yeah 40s I mean I don't 40s right so yeah 40s I mean I don't think it has to be weirdly cold like 35 think it has to be weirdly cold like 35 think it has to be weirdly cold like 35 or 38 I mean I think like being in the or 38 I mean I think like being in the or 38 I mean I think like being in the 40s is legit um there's a therapeutic 40s is legit um there's a therapeutic 40s is legit um there's a therapeutic effect even in the low 50s um but but effect even in the low 50s um but but effect even in the low 50s um but but again you know for us being in Ohio it's again you know for us being in Ohio it's again you know for us being in Ohio it's just easy like three qus of the year to just easy like three qus of the year to just easy like three qus of the year to just like have something like literally just like have something like literally just like have something like literally a kitty pull out back and just it's a kitty pull out back and just it's a kitty pull out back and just it's awesome l in it D we were uh in February awesome l in it D we were uh in February awesome l in it D we were uh in February we went camping or me and my uh College we went camping or me and my uh College we went camping or me and my uh College friends went to a um a cabin in Cooks friends went to a um a cabin in Cooks friends went to a um a cabin in Cooks like right outside Cooks national forest like right outside Cooks national forest like right outside Cooks national forest and there was a stream right there after and there was a stream right there after and there was a stream right there after we were done hiking so we're like dude we were done hiking so we're like dude we were done hiking so we're like dude we got to go back like we gotta go back we got to go back like we gotta go back we got to go back like we gotta go back and hit like like poping that stream so and hit like like poping that stream so and hit like like poping that stream so we went back like took our gear back we went back like took our gear back we went back like took our gear back that we had and we just laid in the that we had and we just laid in the that we had and we just laid in the Stream in February yeah and it was Stream in February yeah and it was Stream in February yeah and it was amazing yeah when when we would when I amazing yeah when when we would when I amazing yeah when when we would when I was at Malone we would do training camp was at Malone we would do training camp was at Malone we would do training camp in mayouth lakes and uh when the snow in mayouth lakes and uh when the snow in mayouth lakes and uh when the snow from the mountains was melting it would from the mountains was melting it would from the mountains was melting it would hit the streams and then the same thing
27:00hit the streams and then the same thing hit the streams and then the same thing they're just freezing cold it's just they're just freezing cold it's just they're just freezing cold it's just like when you get into the cold you like when you get into the cold you like when you get into the cold you never get out of it not either laughing never get out of it not either laughing never get out of it not either laughing or smiling yeah no that's true I never or smiling yeah no that's true I never or smiling yeah no that's true I never come out of a cold shower or a plunge come out of a cold shower or a plunge come out of a cold shower or a plunge thinking that was a bad thinking that was a bad thinking that was a bad idea yeah same the first minute it's idea yeah same the first minute it's idea yeah same the first minute it's like why in the heck do I do this to like why in the heck do I do this to like why in the heck do I do this to myself like and then actually for me I myself like and then actually for me I myself like and then actually for me I remember one time I flew back from remember one time I flew back from remember one time I flew back from Europe and it was like during the middle Europe and it was like during the middle Europe and it was like during the middle of the day and I remember we were flying of the day and I remember we were flying of the day and I remember we were flying you know how like sometimes European you know how like sometimes European you know how like sometimes European flights go above like towards Greenland flights go above like towards Greenland flights go above like towards Greenland and they come down cuz they kind of cut and they come down cuz they kind of cut and they come down cuz they kind of cut the the distance off so we were flying the the distance off so we were flying the the distance off so we were flying over the ocean and then I saw all these over the ocean and then I saw all these over the ocean and then I saw all these like icebergs and Glaciers and stuff and like icebergs and Glaciers and stuff and like icebergs and Glaciers and stuff and I was like oh my God that's crazy like I was like oh my God that's crazy like I was like oh my God that's crazy like just think of how like if this plane just think of how like if this plane just think of how like if this plane landed or was in the ocean right now landed or was in the ocean right now landed or was in the ocean right now like how cold it would be and then like how cold it would be and then like how cold it would be and then sometimes when I'm in the cold shower sometimes when I'm in the cold shower sometimes when I'm in the cold shower and I shut my eyes I have that view in and I shut my eyes I have that view in and I shut my eyes I have that view in my head of that those icebergs and it my head of that those icebergs and it my head of that those icebergs and it freaks me out it makes me think of like freaks me out it makes me think of like freaks me out it makes me think of like Titanic but so to get through it what I Titanic but so to get through it what I Titanic but so to get through it what I literally have to do and this is kind of
28:00literally have to do and this is kind of literally have to do and this is kind of a whm Hof sort of hack is I if when I a whm Hof sort of hack is I if when I a whm Hof sort of hack is I if when I shut my eyes like if I'm showering and I shut my eyes like if I'm showering and I shut my eyes like if I'm showering and I hate it and my the cold plunge I'll hate it and my the cold plunge I'll hate it and my the cold plunge I'll literally think of like putting my hand literally think of like putting my hand literally think of like putting my hand near a warm like a fire and then just near a warm like a fire and then just near a warm like a fire and then just having that visualization does warm you having that visualization does warm you having that visualization does warm you up yeah it's crazy yeah it just reminds up yeah it's crazy yeah it just reminds up yeah it's crazy yeah it just reminds me of Fight Club where like it's like me of Fight Club where like it's like me of Fight Club where like it's like the the happy cave and it's like penguin the the happy cave and it's like penguin the the happy cave and it's like penguin SL but it's like the opposite for you SL but it's like the opposite for you SL but it's like the opposite for you what does the penguin say like follow me what does the penguin say like follow me what does the penguin say like follow me or something like that yeah and then it or something like that yeah and then it or something like that yeah and then it slides down slides down slides down that's a crazy that's a crazy that's a crazy reference yeah so I I don't know I feel reference yeah so I I don't know I feel reference yeah so I I don't know I feel like the um years ago I was looking into like the um years ago I was looking into like the um years ago I was looking into getting a a cryo chamber and then that's getting a a cryo chamber and then that's getting a a cryo chamber and then that's when I started doing the cold showers when I started doing the cold showers when I started doing the cold showers but I was like why would I charge people but I was like why would I charge people but I was like why would I charge people like 50 bucks to do a session of cryo I like 50 bucks to do a session of cryo I like 50 bucks to do a session of cryo I mean I could have made money on it but mean I could have made money on it but mean I could have made money on it but I'm like I just couldn't justify that I'm like I just couldn't justify that I'm like I just couldn't justify that I'm so Frugal I couldn't justify I'm so Frugal I couldn't justify I'm so Frugal I couldn't justify charging people money to like do charging people money to like do charging people money to like do something they could just do at home something they could just do at home something they could just do at home that you actually literally save money that you actually literally save money that you actually literally save money on because you're actually not going use on because you're actually not going use on because you're actually not going use your gas yeah to heat the water so and
29:00your gas yeah to heat the water so and your gas yeah to heat the water so and it helps with that it helps with that uh it helps with that it helps with that uh it helps with that it helps with that uh that mental side of it too yeah like that mental side of it too yeah like that mental side of it too yeah like you're in control you're in the driver's you're in control you're in the driver's you're in control you're in the driver's seat you're not having someone else like seat you're not having someone else like seat you're not having someone else like guide you there like it's your choice to guide you there like it's your choice to guide you there like it's your choice to get it into that shower and turn it onto get it into that shower and turn it onto get it into that shower and turn it onto cold or go outside and get into that cold or go outside and get into that cold or go outside and get into that cold punch especially especially cold punch especially especially cold punch especially especially Northeast Ohio like dude it's like it's Northeast Ohio like dude it's like it's Northeast Ohio like dude it's like it's so badass like I know my neighbors so badass like I know my neighbors so badass like I know my neighbors probably look at me like I'm a probably look at me like I'm a probably look at me like I'm a psychopath like a complete like someone psychopath like a complete like someone psychopath like a complete like someone who's going to like kill people but I who's going to like kill people but I who's going to like kill people but I walk out there in my bathing suit with walk out there in my bathing suit with walk out there in my bathing suit with my towel around my neck and I'm like my towel around my neck and I'm like my towel around my neck and I'm like dude I'm about to just get in this thing dude I'm about to just get in this thing dude I'm about to just get in this thing it's just so cool yeah I know it's so it's just so cool yeah I know it's so it's just so cool yeah I know it's so much fun and there is that sort of much fun and there is that sort of much fun and there is that sort of badass nature to it where you do feel badass nature to it where you do feel badass nature to it where you do feel like you're taking yourself to the next like you're taking yourself to the next like you're taking yourself to the next level um and then but the to the mental level um and then but the to the mental level um and then but the to the mental aspect too it's like you know say you aspect too it's like you know say you aspect too it's like you know say you got in a fight you know with your spouse got in a fight you know with your spouse got in a fight you know with your spouse or you had a bad day at work MH and then or you had a bad day at work MH and then or you had a bad day at work MH and then you go in the sauna MH you're like you you go in the sauna MH you're like you you go in the sauna MH you're like you come out of that thing you're so like
30:00come out of that thing you're so like come out of that thing you're so like relaxed and just chill and you're like relaxed and just chill and you're like relaxed and just chill and you're like it doesn't bother you as much it like it doesn't bother you as much it like it doesn't bother you as much it like literally flatlines you the same thing literally flatlines you the same thing literally flatlines you the same thing with the cold say you're like really with the cold say you're like really with the cold say you're like really stressed out about the day right you got stressed out about the day right you got stressed out about the day right you got a crazy day coming you got a lot of a crazy day coming you got a lot of a crazy day coming you got a lot of patience or you got a lot of stress you patience or you got a lot of stress you patience or you got a lot of stress you got a project du something like that you got a project du something like that you got a project du something like that you get in the cold plunge you get out get in the cold plunge you get out get in the cold plunge you get out you're sharp your mind's like ready to you're sharp your mind's like ready to you're sharp your mind's like ready to go like it's like Flatline like there's go like it's like Flatline like there's go like it's like Flatline like there's there's no like uh like stress like there's no like uh like stress like there's no like uh like stress like anxiety it's just like Sharp mhm and I I anxiety it's just like Sharp mhm and I I anxiety it's just like Sharp mhm and I I literally think of my mind as like it's literally think of my mind as like it's literally think of my mind as like it's like you turn on your inner sniper you like you turn on your inner sniper you like you turn on your inner sniper you know you're very like targeted and know you're very like targeted and know you're very like targeted and you're thinking very clearly and you're you're thinking very clearly and you're you're thinking very clearly and you're have this Focus that's like locked in have this Focus that's like locked in have this Focus that's like locked in yeah yeah it's really cool it's really yeah yeah it's really cool it's really yeah yeah it's really cool it's really cool it's uh yeah like I mean I need to cool it's uh yeah like I mean I need to cool it's uh yeah like I mean I need to get actually I need to experiment more get actually I need to experiment more get actually I need to experiment more with Sona use and and that's one thing with Sona use and and that's one thing with Sona use and and that's one thing that I want to do going into berning that I want to do going into berning that I want to do going into berning River this year is to actually do sonana River this year is to actually do sonana River this year is to actually do sonana use and not do all these like I I just use and not do all these like I I just use and not do all these like I I just felt like all like the heat stuff that I felt like all like the heat stuff that I felt like all like the heat stuff that I was doing last year it made sense but it was doing last year it made sense but it was doing last year it made sense but it was very unorganized it felt very
31:00was very unorganized it felt very was very unorganized it felt very chaotic and so I want to do more SAA use chaotic and so I want to do more SAA use chaotic and so I want to do more SAA use um but on the cold plunge side of it um um but on the cold plunge side of it um um but on the cold plunge side of it um like when I get in there and I know that like when I get in there and I know that like when I get in there and I know that you've said something about this before you've said something about this before you've said something about this before and I feel like you were about to ask me and I feel like you were about to ask me and I feel like you were about to ask me a question about how long I go in yes I a question about how long I go in yes I a question about how long I go in yes I don't time myself anymore when I go into don't time myself anymore when I go into don't time myself anymore when I go into the cold punch because I don't like life the cold punch because I don't like life the cold punch because I don't like life can be so competitive yeah and for me can be so competitive yeah and for me can be so competitive yeah and for me and this and this came from my and this and this came from my and this and this came from my brother-in-law actually because he was brother-in-law actually because he was brother-in-law actually because he was like he's very like he's very cognizant like he's very like he's very cognizant like he's very like he's very cognizant about this stuff like just kind of like about this stuff like just kind of like about this stuff like just kind of like being in the moment and I was like dude being in the moment and I was like dude being in the moment and I was like dude how long have you been like staying in how long have you been like staying in how long have you been like staying in your cold punch and he's like I don't your cold punch and he's like I don't your cold punch and he's like I don't know I don't time myself he's like know I don't time myself he's like know I don't time myself he's like honestly I just go in until I feel like honestly I just go in until I feel like honestly I just go in until I feel like I want to come out but he's like part of I want to come out but he's like part of I want to come out but he's like part of it it's just like I enjoy just it's like it it's just like I enjoy just it's like it it's just like I enjoy just it's like an excuse for me to be outside and I was an excuse for me to be outside and I was an excuse for me to be outside and I was like Oh and it completely changed my like Oh and it completely changed my like Oh and it completely changed my mindset so I would say roughly like mindset so I would say roughly like mindset so I would say roughly like three and a half minutes but I don't three and a half minutes but I don't three and a half minutes but I don't know five to I like I don't know but know five to I like I don't know but know five to I like I don't know but it's just like my time to be outside in it's just like my time to be outside in it's just like my time to be outside in this in this space and it's really it's this in this space and it's really it's this in this space and it's really it's really fun yeah I mean when I done it really fun yeah I mean when I done it really fun yeah I mean when I done it it's always been like you know like a
32:00it's always been like you know like a it's always been like you know like a track workout where you're like all track workout where you're like all track workout where you're like all right I've got like two more laps to go right I've got like two more laps to go right I've got like two more laps to go yeah you have this through this pain and yeah you have this through this pain and yeah you have this through this pain and right and so now you know for me it's a right and so now you know for me it's a right and so now you know for me it's a timing thing where I I enjoy it where timing thing where I I enjoy it where timing thing where I I enjoy it where I'm like all right I'm GNA try and get I'm like all right I'm GNA try and get I'm like all right I'm GNA try and get to 10 but then once 10 hits then it's to 10 but then once 10 hits then it's to 10 but then once 10 hits then it's like all right now what can I do and so like all right now what can I do and so like all right now what can I do and so it's all right now let's go from you it's all right now let's go from you it's all right now let's go from you know the water level up to my like chest know the water level up to my like chest know the water level up to my like chest to now to my chin yeah let's see how to now to my chin yeah let's see how to now to my chin yeah let's see how long I can get that how long you can long I can get that how long you can long I can get that how long you can last underwater bre ex well last underwater bre ex well last underwater bre ex well dude I'm like a solid five minutes like dude I'm like a solid five minutes like dude I'm like a solid five minutes like because I'm like life's too crazy I just because I'm like life's too crazy I just because I'm like life's too crazy I just got to get in and get out once I get got to get in and get out once I get got to get in and get out once I get past the minute or two well that's what past the minute or two well that's what past the minute or two well that's what I'm saying so like if you do a five I'm saying so like if you do a five I'm saying so like if you do a five minute session of it you know say minute session of it you know say minute session of it you know say classic dose three to five minutes at 45 classic dose three to five minutes at 45 classic dose three to five minutes at 45 to 50 to 50 to 50 degrees keep it simple if you do a five degrees keep it simple if you do a five degrees keep it simple if you do a five minute dose your internal dialogue is minute dose your internal dialogue is minute dose your internal dialogue is like what the hell are you doing this is like what the hell are you doing this is like what the hell are you doing this is crazy this crazy this nuts this is nuts crazy this crazy this nuts this is nuts crazy this crazy this nuts this is nuts and then about 90 seconds in it'll go and then about 90 seconds in it'll go and then about 90 seconds in it'll go okay all right you know I'm fine 2
33:00okay all right you know I'm fine 2 okay all right you know I'm fine 2 minutes two and a half minutes great the minutes two and a half minutes great the minutes two and a half minutes great the last two minutes just sharp mhm yeah last two minutes just sharp mhm yeah last two minutes just sharp mhm yeah you're just locked in and they're like you're just locked in and they're like you're just locked in and they're like you're cold it's almost like you you're cold it's almost like you you're cold it's almost like you separate your mind from your body your separate your mind from your body your separate your mind from your body your body's like dude I'm cold and you're body's like dude I'm cold and you're body's like dude I'm cold and you're like okay that's fine you're just cold like okay that's fine you're just cold like okay that's fine you're just cold and then you get out and you're like and then you get out and you're like and then you get out and you're like okay you're cold it's not like it's okay you're cold it's not like it's okay you're cold it's not like it's affected it's not like it's an emotional affected it's not like it's an emotional affected it's not like it's an emotional thing anymore like you literally early thing anymore like you literally early thing anymore like you literally early on you literally like I'm going to die on you literally like I'm going to die on you literally like I'm going to die I'm going to die like that's kind of I'm going to die like that's kind of I'm going to die like that's kind of what your body's telling you and then what your body's telling you and then what your body's telling you and then eventually your brain goes nah dude eventually your brain goes nah dude eventually your brain goes nah dude we've been here before you're not going we've been here before you're not going we've been here before you're not going to die there was um last um Thanksgiving to die there was um last um Thanksgiving to die there was um last um Thanksgiving we had a couple Brazilians standing with we had a couple Brazilians standing with we had a couple Brazilians standing with us that were um swimming here in the US us that were um swimming here in the US us that were um swimming here in the US and so of course they don't really ever and so of course they don't really ever and so of course they don't really ever get cold exposure down in Brazil and get cold exposure down in Brazil and get cold exposure down in Brazil and then the one guy was like absolutely then the one guy was like absolutely then the one guy was like absolutely dead against it and then we kind finally dead against it and then we kind finally dead against it and then we kind finally convinced him you know um you know good convinced him you know um you know good convinced him you know um you know good peer pressure convinced him to do it and peer pressure convinced him to do it and peer pressure convinced him to do it and then um he got in and then he really then um he got in and then he really then um he got in and then he really started to freak out like I don't think started to freak out like I don't think started to freak out like I don't think he ever actually was ever exposed to
34:00he ever actually was ever exposed to he ever actually was ever exposed to decent cold like that and I'm like dude decent cold like that and I'm like dude decent cold like that and I'm like dude you're not going to die like literally you're not going to die like literally you're not going to die like literally you just got to hang in there just 60 you just got to hang in there just 60 you just got to hang in there just 60 seconds like you're G to be fine you seconds like you're G to be fine you seconds like you're G to be fine you just saw us do it and he really had to just saw us do it and he really had to just saw us do it and he really had to emotionally calm himself down really emotionally calm himself down really emotionally calm himself down really yeah it was interesting about to cry he yeah it was interesting about to cry he yeah it was interesting about to cry he wasn't about to cry but like he started wasn't about to cry but like he started wasn't about to cry but like he started to panic like almost like as if somebody to panic like almost like as if somebody to panic like almost like as if somebody was like claustrophobic and they're just was like claustrophobic and they're just was like claustrophobic and they're just like I got to get out of here I got to like I got to get out of here I got to like I got to get out of here I got to get like he started to like Panic like get like he started to like Panic like get like he started to like Panic like in a weird way and then we had to like in a weird way and then we had to like in a weird way and then we had to like we let him him get out and do his thing we let him him get out and do his thing we let him him get out and do his thing but we're telling him like dude you can but we're telling him like dude you can but we're telling him like dude you can do this you saw us survive like you're do this you saw us survive like you're do this you saw us survive like you're literally you just have to get break literally you just have to get break literally you just have to get break through this and then when he was done through this and then when he was done through this and then when he was done with it he was like very emotional with it he was like very emotional with it he was like very emotional because he like conquered this part of because he like conquered this part of because he like conquered this part of himself that he like had never really himself that he like had never really himself that he like had never really conquered and it was interesting what conquered and it was interesting what conquered and it was interesting what happened in theal psyche to watch that happened in theal psyche to watch that happened in theal psyche to watch that to watch that exper a 19-year-old kid to watch that exper a 19-year-old kid to watch that exper a 19-year-old kid and and he his friend that was the other and and he his friend that was the other and and he his friend that was the other Brazilian was really all about it and Brazilian was really all about it and Brazilian was really all about it and then he definitely got peer pressured then he definitely got peer pressured then he definitely got peer pressured into it he's like we're calling him into it he's like we're calling him into it he's like we're calling him Trump and you know he was he wasn't Trump and you know he was he wasn't Trump and you know he was he wasn't Tough Enough and all that stuff and so
35:00Tough Enough and all that stuff and so Tough Enough and all that stuff and so he took that to hard so he tried it but he took that to hard so he tried it but he took that to hard so he tried it but then like he like was like you don't then like he like was like you don't then like he like was like you don't understand this is and he starts kind of understand this is and he starts kind of understand this is and he starts kind of panicking but we got him we got him panicking but we got him we got him panicking but we got him we got him through it nice I mean I think it's through it nice I mean I think it's through it nice I mean I think it's great mental training too I mean like great mental training too I mean like great mental training too I mean like you know if you can push through a pain you know if you can push through a pain you know if you can push through a pain like that because it I mean it does the like that because it I mean it does the like that because it I mean it does the first minute and a half sucks like it's first minute and a half sucks like it's first minute and a half sucks like it's not fun at all yeah um you know you're not fun at all yeah um you know you're not fun at all yeah um you know you're you're feet and your hands are burning you're feet and your hands are burning you're feet and your hands are burning and you know not in a hot way but in a and you know not in a hot way but in a and you know not in a hot way but in a very very cold way and then you just very very cold way and then you just very very cold way and then you just kind of suppress it like I feel like I kind of suppress it like I feel like I kind of suppress it like I feel like I get that crazy anxiety like almost like get that crazy anxiety like almost like get that crazy anxiety like almost like my throat's like bulging out yeah and my throat's like bulging out yeah and my throat's like bulging out yeah and then I just close my eyes for a second then I just close my eyes for a second then I just close my eyes for a second I'm like all right go to my well that's I'm like all right go to my well that's I'm like all right go to my well that's just the thing you have to calm your just the thing you have to calm your just the thing you have to calm your breath you have to get your breath and breath you have to get your breath and breath you have to get your breath and then some people have their hands out then some people have their hands out then some people have their hands out and I'm like dude you got to have your and I'm like dude you got to have your and I'm like dude you got to have your hands like the hands have to be in so hands like the hands have to be in so hands like the hands have to be in so that's another thing that that makes the that's another thing that that makes the that's another thing that that makes the experience so much worse 10 times worse experience so much worse 10 times worse experience so much worse 10 times worse and um but but again that's why whm H and um but but again that's why whm H and um but but again that's why whm H Hal that's how he started was he Hal that's how he started was he Hal that's how he started was he realized that when you get into cold realized that when you get into cold realized that when you get into cold water you're like water you're like water you're like you're like freaking out and like you're like freaking out and like you're like freaking out and like hyperventilating in a sense and then the
36:00hyperventilating in a sense and then the hyperventilating in a sense and then the quicker you jump in from your frontal quicker you jump in from your frontal quicker you jump in from your frontal cortex the quicker you jump in and go cortex the quicker you jump in and go cortex the quicker you jump in and go calm down just control the calm down just control the calm down just control the breathing and then just really just breathing and then just really just breathing and then just really just rushing and just doing that deep rushing and just doing that deep rushing and just doing that deep breathing and then all of a sudden you breathing and then all of a sudden you breathing and then all of a sudden you realize like that quickly gets you to realize like that quickly gets you to realize like that quickly gets you to that state of like calm so if you get in that state of like calm so if you get in that state of like calm so if you get in and you start panicking that's normal and you start panicking that's normal and you start panicking that's normal that's your body just telling you like that's your body just telling you like that's your body just telling you like dude this is a really not smart thing dude this is a really not smart thing dude this is a really not smart thing you're going to freeze to death we all you're going to freeze to death we all you're going to freeze to death we all know you're not going to so calm the know you're not going to so calm the know you're not going to so calm the breathing down and then that'll kind of breathing down and then that'll kind of breathing down and then that'll kind of Flatline quicker but it helps for for my Flatline quicker but it helps for for my Flatline quicker but it helps for for my racing from a mental standpoint like racing from a mental standpoint like racing from a mental standpoint like when 100% things unexpectedly go when 100% things unexpectedly go when 100% things unexpectedly go downhill you can just be like all right downhill you can just be like all right downhill you can just be like all right I got this there's a road I have shoes I got this there's a road I have shoes I got this there's a road I have shoes like we're just GNA hit the pavement like we're just GNA hit the pavement like we're just GNA hit the pavement take one step at a time exactly so uh in take one step at a time exactly so uh in take one step at a time exactly so uh in on January 1 this year so um a running on January 1 this year so um a running on January 1 this year so um a running group up on the west side every January group up on the west side every January group up on the west side every January 1st at noon they go to Lake and they 1st at noon they go to Lake and they 1st at noon they go to Lake and they jump in and so one of my clients was
37:00jump in and so one of my clients was jump in and so one of my clients was like hey you should like come cuz it's like hey you should like come cuz it's like hey you should like come cuz it's like real close I was like all right like real close I was like all right like real close I was like all right yeah I'll show up and we get there and yeah I'll show up and we get there and yeah I'll show up and we get there and we're walking down the steps and there's we're walking down the steps and there's we're walking down the steps and there's this lady cracking open hand warmers this lady cracking open hand warmers this lady cracking open hand warmers she's like I'm just preparing for after she's like I'm just preparing for after she's like I'm just preparing for after I get in and like it's like what are I get in and like it's like what are I get in and like it's like what are those gonna do you're gonna be those gonna do you're gonna be those gonna do you're gonna be so and she's so and she's so and she's like cracking them open but there was like cracking them open but there was like cracking them open but there was something to it because like after we something to it because like after we something to it because like after we were were were done we were walking back up and I was done we were walking back up and I was done we were walking back up and I was walking um her name's Jess and she was walking um her name's Jess and she was walking um her name's Jess and she was just like she like I don't understand just like she like I don't understand just like she like I don't understand why that lady was cracking open him was why that lady was cracking open him was why that lady was cracking open him was like she's like what are those going to like she's like what are those going to like she's like what are those going to do in that moment like it's not going to do in that moment like it's not going to do in that moment like it's not going to do anything like you just do it and then do anything like you just do it and then do anything like you just do it and then like you're fine you're fine afterwards like you're fine you're fine afterwards like you're fine you're fine afterwards and that was really cool to have her see and that was really cool to have her see and that was really cool to have her see that Revelation so I kind of feel like that Revelation so I kind of feel like that Revelation so I kind of feel like so we're kind of rounding third here in so we're kind of rounding third here in so we're kind of rounding third here in the episode but I I feel like another the episode but I I feel like another the episode but I I feel like another thing that I often hear patients talk thing that I often hear patients talk thing that I often hear patients talk about is they're like you don't about is they're like you don't about is they're like you don't understand like I'm a freeze baby yeah understand like I'm a freeze baby yeah understand like I'm a freeze baby yeah some people may have renals which is the some people may have renals which is the some people may have renals which is the thing so they have to be careful with thing so they have to be careful with thing so they have to be careful with co- plunging I get that so obviously
38:00co- plunging I get that so obviously co- plunging I get that so obviously talk to your physician um if you're talk to your physician um if you're talk to your physician um if you're concerned about it but some people are concerned about it but some people are concerned about it but some people are like just freeze babies which is like just freeze babies which is like just freeze babies which is basically like you know you're just basically like you know you're just basically like you know you're just always kind of always kind of always kind of cold that's why you're always sort of cold that's why you're always sort of cold that's why you're always sort of cold because you literally have never cold because you literally have never cold because you literally have never challenged yourself to get to this point challenged yourself to get to this point challenged yourself to get to this point meaning that what is the biggest benefit meaning that what is the biggest benefit meaning that what is the biggest benefit of these cold plunges it's actually of these cold plunges it's actually of these cold plunges it's actually turning white fat over into Brown fat turning white fat over into Brown fat turning white fat over into Brown fat and that's the energy production that and that's the energy production that and that's the energy production that you get so there's that cortisol level you get so there's that cortisol level you get so there's that cortisol level that rises so you get in there it's a that rises so you get in there it's a that rises so you get in there it's a strenuous thing and you're like dude I'm strenuous thing and you're like dude I'm strenuous thing and you're like dude I'm going to die I'm GNA die I'm GNA die and going to die I'm GNA die I'm GNA die and going to die I'm GNA die I'm GNA die and then all of a sudden your cortisol then all of a sudden your cortisol then all of a sudden your cortisol cortisol like ramps right up and which cortisol like ramps right up and which cortisol like ramps right up and which is good because that's what you want in is good because that's what you want in is good because that's what you want in the morning you want your Coro to raise the morning you want your Coro to raise the morning you want your Coro to raise and so that's a benefit there so that's and so that's a benefit there so that's and so that's a benefit there so that's how you get increased energy the second how you get increased energy the second how you get increased energy the second thing is your body starts to go well thing is your body starts to go well thing is your body starts to go well heck if they're going to keep submitting heck if they're going to keep submitting heck if they're going to keep submitting themselves to cold like this we have to themselves to cold like this we have to themselves to cold like this we have to make our fat less we have to make it make our fat less we have to make it make our fat less we have to make it more efficient with energy production so more efficient with energy production so more efficient with energy production so it turns white fat into Brown fat now it turns white fat into Brown fat now it turns white fat into Brown fat now brown fat is healthy fat in the body brown fat is healthy fat in the body brown fat is healthy fat in the body that's the kind of fat that lines organs
39:00that's the kind of fat that lines organs that's the kind of fat that lines organs it turns your white fat on the surface it turns your white fat on the surface it turns your white fat on the surface of your skin and adapost tissue like of your skin and adapost tissue like of your skin and adapost tissue like like if you have like a gut or like like if you have like a gut or like like if you have like a gut or like excess fat somewhere it turns that into excess fat somewhere it turns that into excess fat somewhere it turns that into Brown fat which makes it more metabolic Brown fat which makes it more metabolic Brown fat which makes it more metabolic so your metabolism literally raises you so your metabolism literally raises you so your metabolism literally raises you get more mitochondria in the fat cells get more mitochondria in the fat cells get more mitochondria in the fat cells which makes it which makes it which makes it brown and then that's how you get brown and then that's how you get brown and then that's how you get increase energy prod production and then increase energy prod production and then increase energy prod production and then it's way healthier for you because the it's way healthier for you because the it's way healthier for you because the brown fat actually is much better with brown fat actually is much better with brown fat actually is much better with like insulin regulation and leptin and like insulin regulation and leptin and like insulin regulation and leptin and all these other hormones so there's like all these other hormones so there's like all these other hormones so there's like so many benefits to this so even if so many benefits to this so even if so many benefits to this so even if you're like skinny and don't technically you're like skinny and don't technically you're like skinny and don't technically have any like fat you probably have a a have any like fat you probably have a a have any like fat you probably have a a thin layer of white fat on you that can thin layer of white fat on you that can thin layer of white fat on you that can be turned over to Brown fat and you be turned over to Brown fat and you be turned over to Brown fat and you would be get you would get rid of the would be get you would get rid of the would be get you would get rid of the freeze babiness side of you you know you freeze babiness side of you you know you freeze babiness side of you you know you would get rid of that you wouldn't just would get rid of that you wouldn't just would get rid of that you wouldn't just always be cold and always have like a always be cold and always have like a always be cold and always have like a sniffly nose and always need sweaters sniffly nose and always need sweaters sniffly nose and always need sweaters like that's literally how you get around like that's literally how you get around like that's literally how you get around it is by challenging yourself with that it is by challenging yourself with that it is by challenging yourself with that temperature so it's the actually the temperature so it's the actually the temperature so it's the actually the exact opposite of what you think you exact opposite of what you think you exact opposite of what you think you would need to do so I think that's like would need to do so I think that's like would need to do so I think that's like I have that P that conversation almost I have that P that conversation almost I have that P that conversation almost daily with
40:00daily with daily with patients yeah any last tidbits on this patients yeah any last tidbits on this patients yeah any last tidbits on this topic not off the top of my head yeah topic not off the top of my head yeah topic not off the top of my head yeah what about you I don't think so no I what about you I don't think so no I what about you I don't think so no I mean I think people should try it I mean I think people should try it I mean I think people should try it I think people should be curious if you're think people should be curious if you're think people should be curious if you're I mean if you're curious and I think to I mean if you're curious and I think to I mean if you're curious and I think to go to your point like I I've really go to your point like I I've really go to your point like I I've really have dove have dove have dove into things that my body are telling me into things that my body are telling me into things that my body are telling me that that that I should be doing like put on the I should be doing like put on the I should be doing like put on the sweater or like you know sweater or like you know sweater or like you know uh like or like take the sweater off uh like or like take the sweater off uh like or like take the sweater off whatever it might be I should probably whatever it might be I should probably whatever it might be I should probably sink into that so like if I'm if I'm sink into that so like if I'm if I'm sink into that so like if I'm if I'm like I need to put on the sweater no I like I need to put on the sweater no I like I need to put on the sweater no I should probably not put on that sweater should probably not put on that sweater should probably not put on that sweater I should probably adapt to being in the I should probably adapt to being in the I should probably adapt to being in the cold or like if I'm hot like just leave cold or like if I'm hot like just leave cold or like if I'm hot like just leave it like it's okay like we're in this it like it's okay like we're in this it like it's okay like we're in this environment now we want to adapt to this environment now we want to adapt to this environment now we want to adapt to this environment so we're not so environment so we're not so environment so we're not so uncomfortable and honestly like in the uncomfortable and honestly like in the uncomfortable and honestly like in the long run it makes you more comfortable long run it makes you more comfortable long run it makes you more comfortable yeah that well that brings up another yeah that well that brings up another yeah that well that brings up another interesting point is like um you know interesting point is like um you know interesting point is like um you know Matt ear talked earlier about how we Matt ear talked earlier about how we Matt ear talked earlier about how we organize some of our days in the week so
41:00organize some of our days in the week so organize some of our days in the week so that we can run at lunch and this works that we can run at lunch and this works that we can run at lunch and this works out really well in the in the summer out really well in the in the summer out really well in the in the summer because we get that heat training because we get that heat training because we get that heat training because we literally run in the hottest because we literally run in the hottest because we literally run in the hottest part of the day um and I think too many part of the day um and I think too many part of the day um and I think too many people are afraid of that like I don't people are afraid of that like I don't people are afraid of that like I don't understand why like just run in understand why like just run in understand why like just run in situations that are uncomfortable so situations that are uncomfortable so situations that are uncomfortable so that you don't have to stress about the that you don't have to stress about the that you don't have to stress about the race if the race is going to be hot like race if the race is going to be hot like race if the race is going to be hot like all of a sudden you're like freaking out all of a sudden you're like freaking out all of a sudden you're like freaking out it's like everybody bombed at Boston it's like everybody bombed at Boston it's like everybody bombed at Boston this year this year because everybody's this year this year because everybody's this year this year because everybody's afraid of the heat like just run in the afraid of the heat like just run in the afraid of the heat like just run in the heat I don't understand it or use the heat I don't understand it or use the heat I don't understand it or use the son I mean he could have easily prepped son I mean he could have easily prepped son I mean he could have easily prepped for that um so I kind of don't really for that um so I kind of don't really for that um so I kind of don't really understand like how everybody like was understand like how everybody like was understand like how everybody like was was so um not to adapt affected by that was so um not to adapt affected by that was so um not to adapt affected by that yeah exactly it's like you it's in it's yeah exactly it's like you it's in it's yeah exactly it's like you it's in it's in late April you potentially could be in late April you potentially could be in late April you potentially could be hot so you got to take care of that but hot so you got to take care of that but hot so you got to take care of that but the other thing too is like the cold the other thing too is like the cold the other thing too is like the cold hikes dude I I want to get back doing hikes dude I I want to get back doing hikes dude I I want to get back doing those so like those are cool so like um those so like those are cool so like um those so like those are cool so like um you know how like if you read one of the you know how like if you read one of the you know how like if you read one of the um that what forget the name of the book um that what forget the name of the book um that what forget the name of the book it's one of the Wim Hoff books where it's one of the Wim Hoff books where it's one of the Wim Hoff books where they hike to the top of killamanjaro and they hike to the top of killamanjaro and they hike to the top of killamanjaro and just their skibbies and and basically
42:00just their skibbies and and basically just their skibbies and and basically it's just like you know like it it it's just like you know like it it it's just like you know like it it obviously starts out decent temperature obviously starts out decent temperature obviously starts out decent temperature on this on the lower um elevation and on this on the lower um elevation and on this on the lower um elevation and then gets up higher elevation it's it's then gets up higher elevation it's it's then gets up higher elevation it's it's it's in the 30s and 40s and the whole it's in the 30s and 40s and the whole it's in the 30s and 40s and the whole time they're just breathing and engaging time they're just breathing and engaging time they're just breathing and engaging and just ex embracing sort of the and just ex embracing sort of the and just ex embracing sort of the elements and every now and again in the elements and every now and again in the elements and every now and again in the winter I'll just go outside and run in winter I'll just go outside and run in winter I'll just go outside and run in just shorts oh dude it's I know it's it just shorts oh dude it's I know it's it just shorts oh dude it's I know it's it that give you some good likes looks my that give you some good likes looks my that give you some good likes looks my every day yeah I can't I can't get much every day yeah I can't I can't get much every day yeah I can't I can't get much less than that so yeah so night nigh less than that so yeah so night nigh less than that so yeah so night nigh hikes are the best yeah nigh hikes just hikes are the best yeah nigh hikes just hikes are the best yeah nigh hikes just with like you know just in shorts is is with like you know just in shorts is is with like you know just in shorts is is is a thing we do in the winter as well is a thing we do in the winter as well is a thing we do in the winter as well but I think it's just the mentality of but I think it's just the mentality of but I think it's just the mentality of like you know what we were just talking like you know what we were just talking like you know what we were just talking about like you know people are so Adept about like you know people are so Adept about like you know people are so Adept to not wanting to go out and kind of to not wanting to go out and kind of to not wanting to go out and kind of push themselves and it's like if you push themselves and it's like if you push themselves and it's like if you torture yourself now we in it's in a torture yourself now we in it's in a torture yourself now we in it's in a enclosed environment that you can enclosed environment that you can enclosed environment that you can control then when you're in a race and control then when you're in a race and control then when you're in a race and it's not in your control you're so much it's not in your control you're so much it's not in your control you're so much better for it dude not even in race life better for it dude not even in race life better for it dude not even in race life life yeah well think but think about it
43:00life yeah well think but think about it life yeah well think but think about it this way like in in um I can't remember this way like in in um I can't remember this way like in in um I can't remember what book I read this but they were what book I read this but they were what book I read this but they were talking about this like and this is like talking about this like and this is like talking about this like and this is like a genius idea it's like imagine if a a genius idea it's like imagine if a a genius idea it's like imagine if a clot comes through just an old clot it's clot comes through just an old clot it's clot comes through just an old clot it's flowing through your bloodstream and it flowing through your bloodstream and it flowing through your bloodstream and it gets to a vessel and then it clogs it if gets to a vessel and then it clogs it if gets to a vessel and then it clogs it if you never actually if you spent your you never actually if you spent your you never actually if you spent your whole life at 72 degrees and you never whole life at 72 degrees and you never whole life at 72 degrees and you never challenge your temperature you never challenge your temperature you never challenge your temperature you never forced expansion of blood vessels or forced expansion of blood vessels or forced expansion of blood vessels or contraction of blood vessels contraction of blood vessels contraction of blood vessels expansion of blood vessels on the expansion of blood vessels on the expansion of blood vessels on the extremity with heat but also with heat extremity with heat but also with heat extremity with heat but also with heat exposure you get contraction of blood exposure you get contraction of blood exposure you get contraction of blood vessels to your um internal organs vessels to your um internal organs vessels to your um internal organs because you're trying to send blood to because you're trying to send blood to because you're trying to send blood to the extremities to cool off the vice the extremities to cool off the vice the extremities to cool off the vice versa happens with cold exposure you get versa happens with cold exposure you get versa happens with cold exposure you get increased blood flow to the core to your increased blood flow to the core to your increased blood flow to the core to your gut to the vital organs because you have gut to the vital organs because you have gut to the vital organs because you have to maintain Integrity of the vital to maintain Integrity of the vital to maintain Integrity of the vital organs with cold exposure and your body organs with cold exposure and your body organs with cold exposure and your body takes the blood away from the takes the blood away from the takes the blood away from the extremities to puts it in the vital extremities to puts it in the vital extremities to puts it in the vital organs so the vessels literally open and
44:00organs so the vessels literally open and organs so the vessels literally open and close based on that stimulus so say old close based on that stimulus so say old close based on that stimulus so say old big old clock comes through and you just big old clock comes through and you just big old clock comes through and you just like it just gets in the vessel and you like it just gets in the vessel and you like it just gets in the vessel and you never exposed it to any temperature never exposed it to any temperature never exposed it to any temperature changes then it just stays there and changes then it just stays there and changes then it just stays there and next thing you know you have a clot well next thing you know you have a clot well next thing you know you have a clot well say the clot comes through and you did say the clot comes through and you did say the clot comes through and you did expose it to these temperatures it expose it to these temperatures it expose it to these temperatures it literally will milk it there are muscles literally will milk it there are muscles literally will milk it there are muscles on blood vessels smooth muscle that will on blood vessels smooth muscle that will on blood vessels smooth muscle that will expand and contract and it literally expand and contract and it literally expand and contract and it literally will milk that clot through that is not will milk that clot through that is not will milk that clot through that is not Theory that is actually in practice and Theory that is actually in practice and Theory that is actually in practice and so challenging yourself is that hormetic so challenging yourself is that hormetic so challenging yourself is that hormetic effect that challenge basically makes it effect that challenge basically makes it effect that challenge basically makes it so that you are more resilient for just so that you are more resilient for just so that you are more resilient for just life things that life things that life things that happen yeah I don't know I think that's happen yeah I don't know I think that's happen yeah I don't know I think that's a great idea that's a great idea I've a great idea that's a great idea I've a great idea that's a great idea I've heard that before too it's a pretty cool heard that before too it's a pretty cool heard that before too it's a pretty cool concept and and it's it's it's it's a concept and and it's it's it's it's a concept and and it's it's it's it's a no-brainer too like to me I think I no-brainer too like to me I think I no-brainer too like to me I think I think that right there when I heard that think that right there when I heard that think that right there when I heard that I and I think it was either from um I and I think it was either from um I and I think it was either from um Suzanne soberg she's like the cold Suzanne soberg she's like the cold Suzanne soberg she's like the cold therapy I would say like uh like Guru
45:00therapy I would say like uh like Guru therapy I would say like uh like Guru Guru yeah like she's done so many Guru yeah like she's done so many Guru yeah like she's done so many studies like when she said that I was studies like when she said that I was studies like when she said that I was like yeah that's no break like I'm in like yeah that's no break like I'm in like yeah that's no break like I'm in I'm all well and then that's the thing I'm all well and then that's the thing I'm all well and then that's the thing too like you say you're in there and too like you say you're in there and too like you say you're in there and then you had a family member that died then you had a family member that died then you had a family member that died of a stroke or heart attack or whatever of a stroke or heart attack or whatever of a stroke or heart attack or whatever and you're like you go to do now you and you're like you go to do now you and you're like you go to do now you understand like I'm doing this understand like I'm doing this understand like I'm doing this preventatively yeah I mean it's like preventatively yeah I mean it's like preventatively yeah I mean it's like making small investments in your health making small investments in your health making small investments in your health so that you don't have to make this so that you don't have to make this so that you don't have to make this large investment later in life you know large investment later in life you know large investment later in life you know it's just it's just simple you know it's just it's just simple you know it's just it's just simple you know simple like economics so well I think simple like economics so well I think simple like economics so well I think that's a good uh ending point I think that's a good uh ending point I think that's a good uh ending point I think this was a great episode and um you know this was a great episode and um you know this was a great episode and um you know be sure if you guys like the topic be be be sure if you guys like the topic be be be sure if you guys like the topic be be sure to interact with us and let us know sure to interact with us and let us know sure to interact with us and let us know what you think and and be sure to what you think and and be sure to what you think and and be sure to subscribe to our page and and give us subscribe to our page and and give us subscribe to our page and and give us some feedback so we're always looking some feedback so we're always looking some feedback so we're always looking for so what you guys are thinking about for so what you guys are thinking about for so what you guys are thinking about everything so again thanks for joining everything so again thanks for joining everything so again thanks for joining us joining us thank you us joining us thank you us joining us thank you [Music]