Building a Better Sauna Business Brady Canales Uncommon Living 12
00:00Welcome to the Uncommon Living podcast Welcome to the Uncommon Living podcast where we host dialogues in human where we host dialogues in human where we host dialogues in human resilience. I'm Thomas Seager. I'm an resilience. I'm Thomas Seager. I'm an resilience. I'm Thomas Seager. I'm an engineering professor at Arizona State engineering professor at Arizona State engineering professor at Arizona State University and the CEO of the Morazzco University and the CEO of the Morazzco University and the CEO of the Morazzco Forge Ice Bath Company. My guest today Forge Ice Bath Company. My guest today Forge Ice Bath Company. My guest today is Brady Canales. He's the founder of is Brady Canales. He's the founder of is Brady Canales. He's the founder of the Hot Box Sona Company and a former the Hot Box Sona Company and a former the Hot Box Sona Company and a former Navy Seal. When Brady was in Eastern Navy Seal. When Brady was in Eastern Navy Seal. When Brady was in Eastern Europe, he spent time in Finland Europe, he spent time in Finland Europe, he spent time in Finland learning about thermal contrast therapy. learning about thermal contrast therapy. learning about thermal contrast therapy. And when he was discharged from the And when he was discharged from the And when he was discharged from the military, he came back to the United military, he came back to the United military, he came back to the United States to found his own sona company. In States to found his own sona company. In States to found his own sona company. In this episode, we talk about some of the this episode, we talk about some of the this episode, we talk about some of the misconceptions about sona and how sona misconceptions about sona and how sona misconceptions about sona and how sona and contrast therapy, including ice and contrast therapy, including ice and contrast therapy, including ice baths, can improve mental health. Brady baths, can improve mental health. Brady baths, can improve mental health. Brady Canales, thanks for joining me here to Canales, thanks for joining me here to Canales, thanks for joining me here to talk about Sona, you and Hotbox.
01:00talk about Sona, you and Hotbox. talk about Sona, you and Hotbox. >> Yes, sir. Thanks for having me. It's >> Yes, sir. Thanks for having me. It's >> Yes, sir. Thanks for having me. It's nice to see you. nice to see you. nice to see you. >> We've been using your sauna for almost a >> We've been using your sauna for almost a >> We've been using your sauna for almost a year now, and it's a little different year now, and it's a little different year now, and it's a little different than There are thousand sauna brands out than There are thousand sauna brands out than There are thousand sauna brands out there, but Hotbox is unique. there, but Hotbox is unique. there, but Hotbox is unique. >> For sure. Yeah. It's It's kind of funny >> For sure. Yeah. It's It's kind of funny >> For sure. Yeah. It's It's kind of funny cuz I get um I think one of y'all's uh cuz I get um I think one of y'all's uh cuz I get um I think one of y'all's uh employees there that works in the employees there that works in the employees there that works in the warehouse, he's he's always posting warehouse, he's he's always posting warehouse, he's he's always posting stuff about doing like a little side stuff about doing like a little side stuff about doing like a little side workout in y'all's extra room there. Um workout in y'all's extra room there. Um workout in y'all's extra room there. Um jumping in and out of the sauna. I think jumping in and out of the sauna. I think jumping in and out of the sauna. I think his his username is uh Ice Ice Cold uh his his username is uh Ice Ice Cold uh his his username is uh Ice Ice Cold uh something. But but yeah, so it's it's something. But but yeah, so it's it's something. But but yeah, so it's it's always cool to see I mean just kind of always cool to see I mean just kind of always cool to see I mean just kind of that come through organically and that come through organically and that come through organically and authentically from the guys that are authentically from the guys that are authentically from the guys that are working there. Um, and then talking to working there. Um, and then talking to working there. Um, and then talking to Marvin, uh, your head of manufacturing, Marvin, uh, your head of manufacturing, Marvin, uh, your head of manufacturing, uh, when he visited us, uh, up in Reno uh, when he visited us, uh, up in Reno uh, when he visited us, uh, up in Reno the last few months, uh, just getting the last few months, uh, just getting the last few months, uh, just getting his take on it, uh, honestly has been his take on it, uh, honestly has been his take on it, uh, honestly has been super cool. So, um, super cool. So, um, super cool. So, um, >> the guy you see on Instagram is Pete. >> the guy you see on Instagram is Pete. >> the guy you see on Instagram is Pete. >> Pete is a captain. He's a crew chief we >> Pete is a captain. He's a crew chief we >> Pete is a captain. He's a crew chief we call him. So, he runs our refrigeration,
02:00call him. So, he runs our refrigeration, call him. So, he runs our refrigeration, our electrical, our plumbing side. And our electrical, our plumbing side. And our electrical, our plumbing side. And he knows because of some of the work he knows because of some of the work he knows because of some of the work that I've done with Mike Mutzel, he that I've done with Mike Mutzel, he that I've done with Mike Mutzel, he knows that you do cold before your knows that you do cold before your knows that you do cold before your workout and you do sauna after your workout and you do sauna after your workout and you do sauna after your workout. So Pete's been posting these workout. So Pete's been posting these workout. So Pete's been posting these videos of him getting in the moroscope, videos of him getting in the moroscope, videos of him getting in the moroscope, doing the pre-cooling, then a kettle doing the pre-cooling, then a kettle doing the pre-cooling, then a kettle bell or some squats or some exercise, bell or some squats or some exercise, bell or some squats or some exercise, rewarms his body, then he gets in the rewarms his body, then he gets in the rewarms his body, then he gets in the sauna to recover from the workout. sauna to recover from the workout. sauna to recover from the workout. Almost nobody is doing this order, but Almost nobody is doing this order, but Almost nobody is doing this order, but there's some good science on there's some good science on there's some good science on pre-cooling. Craig Heler at Stanford has pre-cooling. Craig Heler at Stanford has pre-cooling. Craig Heler at Stanford has taught us about how precooling will keep taught us about how precooling will keep taught us about how precooling will keep the muscles cool, prevent the the muscles cool, prevent the the muscles cool, prevent the mitochondria from overheating, boost mitochondria from overheating, boost mitochondria from overheating, boost your peak muscle power output, extend your peak muscle power output, extend your peak muscle power output, extend your endurance. So, pre-cooling is your endurance. So, pre-cooling is your endurance. So, pre-cooling is great. Then you do your exercise. great. Then you do your exercise. great. Then you do your exercise. There's some good science on sauna for There's some good science on sauna for There's some good science on sauna for recovery from exercise. Sona after a recovery from exercise. Sona after a recovery from exercise. Sona after a workout is way better than doing cold workout is way better than doing cold workout is way better than doing cold plunge or ice bath after a workout. plunge or ice bath after a workout. plunge or ice bath after a workout. Nobody, at least in the clinical
03:00Nobody, at least in the clinical Nobody, at least in the clinical community, has yet studied this this community, has yet studied this this community, has yet studied this this three layer sandwich, pre-cool with an three layer sandwich, pre-cool with an three layer sandwich, pre-cool with an ice bath, exercise, and then sauna to ice bath, exercise, and then sauna to ice bath, exercise, and then sauna to see what the physiological benefits of see what the physiological benefits of see what the physiological benefits of that would be. So Pete's been running that would be. So Pete's been running that would be. So Pete's been running his own N equals 1 experiments to see his own N equals 1 experiments to see his own N equals 1 experiments to see how it comes out. how it comes out. how it comes out. >> Cool. I would love to talk to him. I >> Cool. I would love to talk to him. I >> Cool. I would love to talk to him. I mean, I'm I'm excited to talk to you mean, I'm I'm excited to talk to you mean, I'm I'm excited to talk to you about this side of things, honestly, about this side of things, honestly, about this side of things, honestly, because um you know, I started this because um you know, I started this because um you know, I started this company mainly based off of like the way company mainly based off of like the way company mainly based off of like the way the sauna made me feel um after, you the sauna made me feel um after, you the sauna made me feel um after, you know, doing the you know, um you know, know, doing the you know, um you know, know, doing the you know, um you know, prescribed dosing of it, you know, this prescribed dosing of it, you know, this prescribed dosing of it, you know, this the specific time at a specific the specific time at a specific the specific time at a specific temperature. Um that's really what made temperature. Um that's really what made temperature. Um that's really what made me passionate about it. But then me passionate about it. But then me passionate about it. But then obviously like the I feel like the the obviously like the I feel like the the obviously like the I feel like the the educational side is becoming more and educational side is becoming more and educational side is becoming more and more common knowledge like people know more common knowledge like people know more common knowledge like people know the statistics, the mortality rates. um the statistics, the mortality rates. um the statistics, the mortality rates. um you know the decrease in um all things you know the decrease in um all things you know the decrease in um all things that kill you uh pretty much and then that kill you uh pretty much and then that kill you uh pretty much and then also the performance-enhancing side of also the performance-enhancing side of also the performance-enhancing side of things. But um it's really cool to see things. But um it's really cool to see things. But um it's really cool to see like specific levels of testing like I'm
04:00like specific levels of testing like I'm like specific levels of testing like I'm always like listening to Andrew Huberman always like listening to Andrew Huberman always like listening to Andrew Huberman or Dr. or Dr. Ronda Patrick um on or Dr. or Dr. Ronda Patrick um on or Dr. or Dr. Ronda Patrick um on certain like growth hormone protocols certain like growth hormone protocols certain like growth hormone protocols and stuff like that. But but mainly I I and stuff like that. But but mainly I I and stuff like that. But but mainly I I started the the hot box um because of started the the hot box um because of started the the hot box um because of the way it made me feel like once I the way it made me feel like once I the way it made me feel like once I first started using um the sauna it I I first started using um the sauna it I I first started using um the sauna it I I was hooked with how um you know was hooked with how um you know was hooked with how um you know mentally, physically it just it it made mentally, physically it just it it made mentally, physically it just it it made me recover faster. Um it made me me recover faster. Um it made me me recover faster. Um it made me mentally more stable uh my mood more mentally more stable uh my mood more mentally more stable uh my mood more stable. And so, um, yeah, I was always stable. And so, um, yeah, I was always stable. And so, um, yeah, I was always looking for a sauna after, you know, looking for a sauna after, you know, looking for a sauna after, you know, using it for, you know, longer periods using it for, you know, longer periods using it for, you know, longer periods of time at higher heat. And so, of time at higher heat. And so, of time at higher heat. And so, >> where was your first sauna experience? >> where was your first sauna experience? >> where was your first sauna experience? >> Um, I spent a lot of time, so I was a >> Um, I spent a lot of time, so I was a >> Um, I spent a lot of time, so I was a SEAL for six years. And so, I spent a SEAL for six years. And so, I spent a SEAL for six years. And so, I spent a lot of time in Europe um, traveling all lot of time in Europe um, traveling all lot of time in Europe um, traveling all around. So, working with uh, the around. So, working with uh, the around. So, working with uh, the Germans, um, guys up in Scandinavian Germans, um, guys up in Scandinavian Germans, um, guys up in Scandinavian countries like the the Finnish Jäger and countries like the the Finnish Jäger and countries like the the Finnish Jäger and Eastern European countries. And so Eastern European countries. And so Eastern European countries. And so that's when I first really got into like
05:00that's when I first really got into like that's when I first really got into like heat therapy. Um, aside from that, heat therapy. Um, aside from that, heat therapy. Um, aside from that, really it's just like a post-workout uh really it's just like a post-workout uh really it's just like a post-workout uh room to do some crunches after, you room to do some crunches after, you room to do some crunches after, you know, a workout after high school or know, a workout after high school or know, a workout after high school or something. We thought that, you know, it something. We thought that, you know, it something. We thought that, you know, it would help uh help get you chiseled uh would help uh help get you chiseled uh would help uh help get you chiseled uh help form a six-pack a little easier. So help form a six-pack a little easier. So help form a six-pack a little easier. So we do like five minute crunch sessions, we do like five minute crunch sessions, we do like five minute crunch sessions, you know, in the sauna after a workout. you know, in the sauna after a workout. you know, in the sauna after a workout. Um, Um, Um, >> so you would exercise in the sauna. >> so you would exercise in the sauna. >> so you would exercise in the sauna. >> We would. Yeah. I mean like as kids, you >> We would. Yeah. I mean like as kids, you >> We would. Yeah. I mean like as kids, you know, and we thought, you know, we were know, and we thought, you know, we were know, and we thought, you know, we were under the assump assumption that like it under the assump assumption that like it under the assump assumption that like it would help us like burn belly fat if we would help us like burn belly fat if we would help us like burn belly fat if we did crunches in the sauna. Um but it did crunches in the sauna. Um but it did crunches in the sauna. Um but it wasn't really looked at as like a heat wasn't really looked at as like a heat wasn't really looked at as like a heat therapy tool, you know, like inducing therapy tool, you know, like inducing therapy tool, you know, like inducing heat shock proteins um getting the heat shock proteins um getting the heat shock proteins um getting the mental mental benefits from it. Um mental mental benefits from it. Um mental mental benefits from it. Um until, you know, I started working with until, you know, I started working with until, you know, I started working with the Finnish Jagger specifically um and the Finnish Jagger specifically um and the Finnish Jagger specifically um and seeing like the effects of it long term seeing like the effects of it long term seeing like the effects of it long term and how they kind of view the sign. I and how they kind of view the sign. I and how they kind of view the sign. I mean, obviously culturally it's a a mean, obviously culturally it's a a mean, obviously culturally it's a a staple, like it's a huge part of their staple, like it's a huge part of their staple, like it's a huge part of their culture, but I think there's like, you culture, but I think there's like, you culture, but I think there's like, you know, it's a common thing that's said
06:00know, it's a common thing that's said know, it's a common thing that's said it's like there's uh two saunas for it's like there's uh two saunas for it's like there's uh two saunas for every household and in Finland and and every household and in Finland and and every household and in Finland and and Norway. And so um so working with these Norway. And so um so working with these Norway. And so um so working with these guys, you know, they they saw it or at guys, you know, they they saw it or at guys, you know, they they saw it or at least their leadership did. Um they saw least their leadership did. Um they saw least their leadership did. Um they saw it more as like a tactical asset um to it more as like a tactical asset um to it more as like a tactical asset um to keep their uh guys like operationally keep their uh guys like operationally keep their uh guys like operationally sound. And so I that was around 2013. So sound. And so I that was around 2013. So sound. And so I that was around 2013. So the educational side of things wasn't the educational side of things wasn't the educational side of things wasn't really I I didn't know much about it really I I didn't know much about it really I I didn't know much about it until I started hearing about it, you until I started hearing about it, you until I started hearing about it, you know, pop up on podcasts and stuff like know, pop up on podcasts and stuff like know, pop up on podcasts and stuff like that. Um, but I did know like how it that. Um, but I did know like how it that. Um, but I did know like how it made me feel. And so when I got out of made me feel. And so when I got out of made me feel. And so when I got out of the military, I saw, you know, a huge the military, I saw, you know, a huge the military, I saw, you know, a huge gap like there was, you know, the we gap like there was, you know, the we gap like there was, you know, the we were still catching up like our western were still catching up like our western were still catching up like our western culture when it came to like heat culture when it came to like heat culture when it came to like heat therapy. Like you might find a sauna um therapy. Like you might find a sauna um therapy. Like you might find a sauna um at a at a spot that sells like jacuzzi's at a at a spot that sells like jacuzzi's at a at a spot that sells like jacuzzi's or you know, something like that. Um, or you know, something like that. Um, or you know, something like that. Um, and so I was always like searching and so I was always like searching and so I was always like searching around trying to find like a place to go around trying to find like a place to go around trying to find like a place to go to a sauna, like Russian bath houses. I to a sauna, like Russian bath houses. I to a sauna, like Russian bath houses. I was living in Boston at the time. Um, was living in Boston at the time. Um, was living in Boston at the time. Um, and so nothing that was like consistent
07:00and so nothing that was like consistent and so nothing that was like consistent enough. Like I used one at the the YMCA enough. Like I used one at the the YMCA enough. Like I used one at the the YMCA in Charles Town, uh, Boston, and it was in Charles Town, uh, Boston, and it was in Charles Town, uh, Boston, and it was like constantly out of order. There was like constantly out of order. There was like constantly out of order. There was always something going on like the it always something going on like the it always something going on like the it was in the basement of the gym, so it was in the basement of the gym, so it was in the basement of the gym, so it was constantly getting flooded out. um was constantly getting flooded out. um was constantly getting flooded out. um and a bunch of you know weird and a bunch of you know weird and a bunch of you know weird occurrences with the like electrical occurrences with the like electrical occurrences with the like electrical system that would just cause it to to system that would just cause it to to system that would just cause it to to not be consistent or it wouldn't get hot not be consistent or it wouldn't get hot not be consistent or it wouldn't get hot enough. And so, um, it wasn't up until I enough. And so, um, it wasn't up until I enough. And so, um, it wasn't up until I moved to Austin, uh, back home, that's moved to Austin, uh, back home, that's moved to Austin, uh, back home, that's like around where I'm from, like around where I'm from, like around where I'm from, um, that I was looking into, you know, um, that I was looking into, you know, um, that I was looking into, you know, buying one for myself. And, you know, buying one for myself. And, you know, buying one for myself. And, you know, the marketplace was kind of scarce. like the marketplace was kind of scarce. like the marketplace was kind of scarce. like it was either um you know a big barrel it was either um you know a big barrel it was either um you know a big barrel sauna where you'd have to wire your sauna where you'd have to wire your sauna where you'd have to wire your house to 220 or you know something that house to 220 or you know something that house to 220 or you know something that was made overseas like a specific uh was made overseas like a specific uh was made overseas like a specific uh infrared sauna that infrared sauna that infrared sauna that >> some Chinese infrared that doesn't get >> some Chinese infrared that doesn't get >> some Chinese infrared that doesn't get up above 145 degrees. Yeah. up above 145 degrees. Yeah. up above 145 degrees. Yeah. >> Right. Yeah. And so like cheaply made >> Right. Yeah. And so like cheaply made >> Right. Yeah. And so like cheaply made obviously poor labor all that. Um but obviously poor labor all that. Um but obviously poor labor all that. Um but yeah doesn't necessarily get hot enough.
08:00yeah doesn't necessarily get hot enough. yeah doesn't necessarily get hot enough. Um and so I just decided to start making Um and so I just decided to start making Um and so I just decided to start making my own. And so I really built it out of my own. And so I really built it out of my own. And so I really built it out of necessity. So I knew I wanted something necessity. So I knew I wanted something necessity. So I knew I wanted something smaller, a smaller form factor to where smaller, a smaller form factor to where smaller, a smaller form factor to where you could plug in, you know, 110. So the you could plug in, you know, 110. So the you could plug in, you know, 110. So the smaller the better, uh, within reason, smaller the better, uh, within reason, smaller the better, uh, within reason, obviously, within a certain comfort obviously, within a certain comfort obviously, within a certain comfort level to, um, really maximize the heat level to, um, really maximize the heat level to, um, really maximize the heat based off of, you know, a smaller amount based off of, you know, a smaller amount based off of, you know, a smaller amount of power. And so I made like the first of power. And so I made like the first of power. And so I made like the first prototype out of my garage. Um, and that prototype out of my garage. Um, and that prototype out of my garage. Um, and that just kind of evolved into me becoming just kind of evolved into me becoming just kind of evolved into me becoming more and more obsessed with the design. more and more obsessed with the design. more and more obsessed with the design. Um, I grew up doing like some level of Um, I grew up doing like some level of Um, I grew up doing like some level of carpentry, but nothing like to this carpentry, but nothing like to this carpentry, but nothing like to this level. I definitely learned on the fly level. I definitely learned on the fly level. I definitely learned on the fly as I was like flushing out the design as I was like flushing out the design as I was like flushing out the design and learned about materials and, you and learned about materials and, you and learned about materials and, you know, what not to use, certain ways to know, what not to use, certain ways to know, what not to use, certain ways to dry the wood, different profiles of dry the wood, different profiles of dry the wood, different profiles of wood. Um, and you know, that was kind of wood. Um, and you know, that was kind of wood. Um, and you know, that was kind of like in and out, I guess. Um, because I like in and out, I guess. Um, because I like in and out, I guess. Um, because I didn't really know if this was like too didn't really know if this was like too didn't really know if this was like too niche for people because the, you know,
09:00niche for people because the, you know, niche for people because the, you know, the design's a little intimidating. uh the design's a little intimidating. uh the design's a little intimidating. uh it being such a confined space uh at it being such a confined space uh at it being such a confined space uh at high high high >> it's a little claustrophobic. >> it's a little claustrophobic. >> it's a little claustrophobic. >> It is. Yeah. And definitely I mean >> It is. Yeah. And definitely I mean >> It is. Yeah. And definitely I mean especially for women I feel like women especially for women I feel like women especially for women I feel like women usually are a little bit more usually are a little bit more usually are a little bit more claustrophobic than men which has been claustrophobic than men which has been claustrophobic than men which has been interesting to see over the last couple interesting to see over the last couple interesting to see over the last couple years u with like the wife approval that years u with like the wife approval that years u with like the wife approval that most guys need to to get into this. Um most guys need to to get into this. Um most guys need to to get into this. Um but I I just kind of stuck with it. Um but I I just kind of stuck with it. Um but I I just kind of stuck with it. Um kept fleshing out the design and finally kept fleshing out the design and finally kept fleshing out the design and finally like I had like different opening like I had like different opening like I had like different opening systems. I used uh traditional sauna systems. I used uh traditional sauna systems. I used uh traditional sauna heaters and and then I moved to like an heaters and and then I moved to like an heaters and and then I moved to like an infrared incandescent uh bulb design. Um infrared incandescent uh bulb design. Um infrared incandescent uh bulb design. Um found out that that for me for this found out that that for me for this found out that that for me for this application was much better than you application was much better than you application was much better than you know traditional wired saunas or heaters know traditional wired saunas or heaters know traditional wired saunas or heaters mainly because most of those are made mainly because most of those are made mainly because most of those are made overseas too and they're just too overseas too and they're just too overseas too and they're just too finicky. they're too expensive to finicky. they're too expensive to finicky. they're too expensive to replace. And so, um, and so I really replace. And so, um, and so I really replace. And so, um, and so I really started looking into more about how like started looking into more about how like started looking into more about how like to keep the ambient temperature up while to keep the ambient temperature up while to keep the ambient temperature up while using infrared, the the light spectrum
10:00using infrared, the the light spectrum using infrared, the the light spectrum and red light therapy. And so, the and red light therapy. And so, the and red light therapy. And so, the incandescent bulb just like checked all incandescent bulb just like checked all incandescent bulb just like checked all boxes. And then I kind of found a way to boxes. And then I kind of found a way to boxes. And then I kind of found a way to make the structure kind of work in make the structure kind of work in make the structure kind of work in tandem with the heating element. Um, so tandem with the heating element. Um, so tandem with the heating element. Um, so like heat reflective panels, stainless like heat reflective panels, stainless like heat reflective panels, stainless steel panels, wool insulation to keep steel panels, wool insulation to keep steel panels, wool insulation to keep everything um natural and keep the R everything um natural and keep the R everything um natural and keep the R value up and uh and then like the way value up and uh and then like the way value up and uh and then like the way that the lid opens and closes, not that the lid opens and closes, not that the lid opens and closes, not having any outward opening opening having any outward opening opening having any outward opening opening apparatuses apparatuses apparatuses and the way that it assembles. and the way that it assembles. and the way that it assembles. >> So there's no swinging door with a hot >> So there's no swinging door with a hot >> So there's no swinging door with a hot buck sonic because every time you open buck sonic because every time you open buck sonic because every time you open the door, you suck heat out and then you the door, you suck heat out and then you the door, you suck heat out and then you uh replace it with cold air in. But your uh replace it with cold air in. But your uh replace it with cold air in. But your slider has less heat exchange when you slider has less heat exchange when you slider has less heat exchange when you open up the door. Is that what you're open up the door. Is that what you're open up the door. Is that what you're >> That could be true. Um, not necessarily. >> That could be true. Um, not necessarily. >> That could be true. Um, not necessarily. That wasn't like the main focus. It was That wasn't like the main focus. It was That wasn't like the main focus. It was really just to save space because like I really just to save space because like I really just to save space because like I wanted it to be as compact as possible wanted it to be as compact as possible wanted it to be as compact as possible without any like extra square footage without any like extra square footage without any like extra square footage having to be taken up with the the door having to be taken up with the the door having to be taken up with the the door opening swinging open so that you could
11:00opening swinging open so that you could opening swinging open so that you could put it in like a New York condo or a put it in like a New York condo or a put it in like a New York condo or a garage gym where it's not going to, you garage gym where it's not going to, you garage gym where it's not going to, you know, take up any more room. And that's know, take up any more room. And that's know, take up any more room. And that's why you kind of have to step over a why you kind of have to step over a why you kind of have to step over a little threshold to get into the sauna little threshold to get into the sauna little threshold to get into the sauna so that like, you know, it maximizes so that like, you know, it maximizes so that like, you know, it maximizes every bit of your space that you every bit of your space that you every bit of your space that you possibly can. And so that was the main possibly can. And so that was the main possibly can. And so that was the main focus there. Um, but then I also wanted focus there. Um, but then I also wanted focus there. Um, but then I also wanted to make it flat packable and easy to to make it flat packable and easy to to make it flat packable and easy to assemble and and so I just really like assemble and and so I just really like assemble and and so I just really like my I I got lost in the sauce and my I I got lost in the sauce and my I I got lost in the sauce and honestly like at first I felt like it honestly like at first I felt like it honestly like at first I felt like it was like overengineered and I was was like overengineered and I was was like overengineered and I was putting too much like money into the putting too much like money into the putting too much like money into the design. Um, but then I kind of just design. Um, but then I kind of just design. Um, but then I kind of just adopted like the you know what, I'm here adopted like the you know what, I'm here adopted like the you know what, I'm here anyways. I'm I'm spending so much time anyways. I'm I'm spending so much time anyways. I'm I'm spending so much time doing this. I might as well make it as doing this. I might as well make it as doing this. I might as well make it as good as possible and you know shake out good as possible and you know shake out good as possible and you know shake out the the cost later. And so that's kind the the cost later. And so that's kind the the cost later. And so that's kind of how it evolved over the years. of how it evolved over the years. of how it evolved over the years. >> Well, let's talk a little bit about you. >> Well, let's talk a little bit about you. >> Well, let's talk a little bit about you. Uh it sounds like you grew up in Texas. Uh it sounds like you grew up in Texas. Uh it sounds like you grew up in Texas. You did your BUDS training. You were You did your BUDS training. You were You did your BUDS training. You were stationed as a Navy Seal out of Virginia
12:00stationed as a Navy Seal out of Virginia stationed as a Navy Seal out of Virginia and then um deployed in Eastern Europe and then um deployed in Eastern Europe and then um deployed in Eastern Europe where you met the Finnish special where you met the Finnish special where you met the Finnish special forces, sort of your counterparts in forces, sort of your counterparts in forces, sort of your counterparts in Finland, the Jaggers. Have I got it Finland, the Jaggers. Have I got it Finland, the Jaggers. Have I got it right so far? right so far? right so far? >> Yes, sir. Yeah, we did a lot of um like >> Yes, sir. Yeah, we did a lot of um like >> Yes, sir. Yeah, we did a lot of um like group training exercises, like big group group training exercises, like big group group training exercises, like big group training exercises where we got to just training exercises where we got to just training exercises where we got to just meet all kinds of people throughout meet all kinds of people throughout meet all kinds of people throughout Europe. Um but mainly, yeah, the Finnish Europe. Um but mainly, yeah, the Finnish Europe. Um but mainly, yeah, the Finnish Jagger is who I worked with. Um all Jagger is who I worked with. Um all Jagger is who I worked with. Um all across Europe, across Europe, across Europe, >> Sona is probably the only word in the >> Sona is probably the only word in the >> Sona is probably the only word in the Finnish language that has now been Finnish language that has now been Finnish language that has now been adopted in English and I don't think we adopted in English and I don't think we adopted in English and I don't think we understand it correctly. In Finland, all understand it correctly. In Finland, all understand it correctly. In Finland, all the research papers say, "So, we do the research papers say, "So, we do the research papers say, "So, we do sona." But they're explicit in sona." But they're explicit in sona." But they're explicit in describing that sona to them is thermal describing that sona to them is thermal describing that sona to them is thermal contrast. It's not just the hot box, contrast. It's not just the hot box, contrast. It's not just the hot box, it's also the cold. In Finland, you go it's also the cold. In Finland, you go it's also the cold. In Finland, you go roll in the snow or you jump in the lake roll in the snow or you jump in the lake roll in the snow or you jump in the lake or I don't know, you could plunge in the or I don't know, you could plunge in the or I don't know, you could plunge in the Gulf of Finland or the Baltic Sea or Gulf of Finland or the Baltic Sea or Gulf of Finland or the Baltic Sea or something. You have so much cold something. You have so much cold something. You have so much cold available. When you come back to Texas
13:00available. When you come back to Texas available. When you come back to Texas and you're listening to Huberman or and you're listening to Huberman or and you're listening to Huberman or you're listening to Ronda Patrick, you're listening to Ronda Patrick, you're listening to Ronda Patrick, Rhonda is a a great example of someone Rhonda is a a great example of someone Rhonda is a a great example of someone who forgets to say that all of those who forgets to say that all of those who forgets to say that all of those statistics that are coming out of statistics that are coming out of statistics that are coming out of Finland, all the epidemiological Finland, all the epidemiological Finland, all the epidemiological studies, all the comparisons of people studies, all the comparisons of people studies, all the comparisons of people who sauna and people who don't, who show who sauna and people who don't, who show who sauna and people who don't, who show a reduction in all cause mortality, she a reduction in all cause mortality, she a reduction in all cause mortality, she forgets to say that it's really thermal forgets to say that it's really thermal forgets to say that it's really thermal contrast therapy that they're doing in contrast therapy that they're doing in contrast therapy that they're doing in Finland, that they're taking the cold Finland, that they're taking the cold Finland, that they're taking the cold for granted because they so much of it. for granted because they so much of it. for granted because they so much of it. Even in the summertime, you know, the Even in the summertime, you know, the Even in the summertime, you know, the sun never sets in parts of Finland sun never sets in parts of Finland sun never sets in parts of Finland during the summer, but the lake stays during the summer, but the lake stays during the summer, but the lake stays cold. When you get back to Austin now, cold. When you get back to Austin now, cold. When you get back to Austin now, everybody's talking about sauna, but everybody's talking about sauna, but everybody's talking about sauna, but they forget about the cold part. What they forget about the cold part. What they forget about the cold part. What are you doing for the cold? are you doing for the cold? are you doing for the cold? Uh me for the cold. Um I I I use the the Uh me for the cold. Um I I I use the the Uh me for the cold. Um I I I use the the Morazzco um that I donated to uh Kaizen Morazzco um that I donated to uh Kaizen Morazzco um that I donated to uh Kaizen in Virginia Beach um an adaptive in Virginia Beach um an adaptive in Virginia Beach um an adaptive training um like uh cross trainining
14:00training um like uh cross trainining training um like uh cross trainining gym. Um so they're getting really good gym. Um so they're getting really good gym. Um so they're getting really good use out of it. But other than that, um I use out of it. But other than that, um I use out of it. But other than that, um I will do more of a a weekend ritual. It's will do more of a a weekend ritual. It's will do more of a a weekend ritual. It's not an every day thing for me. Um where not an every day thing for me. Um where not an every day thing for me. Um where I'll just go buy bags of ice and put it I'll just go buy bags of ice and put it I'll just go buy bags of ice and put it in a trough. So I'll do like the the in a trough. So I'll do like the the in a trough. So I'll do like the the growth hormone protocol. Um, but it is growth hormone protocol. Um, but it is growth hormone protocol. Um, but it is something that I need to fit into my something that I need to fit into my something that I need to fit into my schedule more and more. Um, and maybe schedule more and more. Um, and maybe schedule more and more. Um, and maybe after this call, I'll I'll be a little after this call, I'll I'll be a little after this call, I'll I'll be a little bit more motivated to to uh get into it bit more motivated to to uh get into it bit more motivated to to uh get into it now that we're talking. now that we're talking. now that we're talking. >> It makes sense. Summer in Virginia or >> It makes sense. Summer in Virginia or >> It makes sense. Summer in Virginia or summer in Nevada. Uh, it's hard to find summer in Nevada. Uh, it's hard to find summer in Nevada. Uh, it's hard to find the cold, but I have exactly the the cold, but I have exactly the the cold, but I have exactly the opposite problem. It took us a long time opposite problem. It took us a long time opposite problem. It took us a long time to buy a sona at Morosco. I live in to buy a sona at Morosco. I live in to buy a sona at Morosco. I live in Phoenix, Arizona. It's the hottest city Phoenix, Arizona. It's the hottest city Phoenix, Arizona. It's the hottest city in North America. If I wanted heat, I in North America. If I wanted heat, I in North America. If I wanted heat, I would just park my car in the sunshine would just park my car in the sunshine would just park my car in the sunshine in the parking lot, get up to 180 in the parking lot, get up to 180 in the parking lot, get up to 180 degrees Fahrenheit in there, and then degrees Fahrenheit in there, and then degrees Fahrenheit in there, and then I'd sit in my car for a little while. I I'd sit in my car for a little while. I I'd sit in my car for a little while. I call it car sona. And then, of course, I call it car sona. And then, of course, I call it car sona. And then, of course, I need an ice bath so that I can get the need an ice bath so that I can get the need an ice bath so that I can get the cold. So, in Phoenix, I can take the
15:00cold. So, in Phoenix, I can take the cold. So, in Phoenix, I can take the heat for granted, but I can't take the heat for granted, but I can't take the heat for granted, but I can't take the cold. I need that ice bath. In Finland, cold. I need that ice bath. In Finland, cold. I need that ice bath. In Finland, they can take the cold for granted, but they can take the cold for granted, but they can take the cold for granted, but they can't take the heat. They need that they can't take the heat. They need that they can't take the heat. They need that sona. When you moved back to Texas, I sona. When you moved back to Texas, I sona. When you moved back to Texas, I think you told me you had a job working think you told me you had a job working think you told me you had a job working for Joe Rogan on his security team. for Joe Rogan on his security team. for Joe Rogan on his security team. >> Yeah, I did. Um, and that's kind of >> Yeah, I did. Um, and that's kind of >> Yeah, I did. Um, and that's kind of ironic that you brought that up because ironic that you brought that up because ironic that you brought that up because uh that's when I first started her uh uh that's when I first started her uh uh that's when I first started her uh hearing about Morasco and uh you hearing about Morasco and uh you hearing about Morasco and uh you actually you guys actually um sponsored actually you guys actually um sponsored actually you guys actually um sponsored one of my buddies that I was in buds one of my buddies that I was in buds one of my buddies that I was in buds with um and he was diagnosed with MS and with um and he was diagnosed with MS and with um and he was diagnosed with MS and so I kind of got two streams of like I so I kind of got two streams of like I so I kind of got two streams of like I just kept hearing your your name pop up. just kept hearing your your name pop up. just kept hearing your your name pop up. I remember you know Joe getting one. And I remember you know Joe getting one. And I remember you know Joe getting one. And the guys were talking about, you know, the guys were talking about, you know, the guys were talking about, you know, this uh high-erforming this uh high-erforming this uh high-erforming ice barrel that he would use that would, ice barrel that he would use that would, ice barrel that he would use that would, you know, create its own ice. It was you know, create its own ice. It was you know, create its own ice. It was like super cold, more so than like the, like super cold, more so than like the, like super cold, more so than like the, you know, the whirlpools that we would you know, the whirlpools that we would you know, the whirlpools that we would use in in football after practice or
16:00use in in football after practice or use in in football after practice or whatever for rehab. And uh and so that whatever for rehab. And uh and so that whatever for rehab. And uh and so that kind of started circulating right around kind of started circulating right around kind of started circulating right around the time where I was building this the time where I was building this the time where I was building this prototype in my garage in Austin, you prototype in my garage in Austin, you prototype in my garage in Austin, you know, driving guests back and forth from know, driving guests back and forth from know, driving guests back and forth from the studio for Joe and just having like the studio for Joe and just having like the studio for Joe and just having like this health and wellness kind of like this health and wellness kind of like this health and wellness kind of like refresh of like socializing with people refresh of like socializing with people refresh of like socializing with people in and out of like driving them to the in and out of like driving them to the in and out of like driving them to the studio and then hearing the guys like studio and then hearing the guys like studio and then hearing the guys like just getting back into more like intense just getting back into more like intense just getting back into more like intense workouts and recovery and like the workouts and recovery and like the workouts and recovery and like the health and wellness space. And so that's health and wellness space. And so that's health and wellness space. And so that's when I really like just hearing you guys when I really like just hearing you guys when I really like just hearing you guys like build the company. It really like build the company. It really like build the company. It really inspired me to like just keep going and inspired me to like just keep going and inspired me to like just keep going and keep you know uh fleshing out designs keep you know uh fleshing out designs keep you know uh fleshing out designs and and start the business. And so and and start the business. And so and and start the business. And so >> that is a wonderful story. But I want to >> that is a wonderful story. But I want to >> that is a wonderful story. But I want to back up. I didn't realize you went back up. I didn't realize you went back up. I didn't realize you went through Buds training with Justin through Buds training with Justin through Buds training with Justin Hogland. Hogland. Hogland. >> I did. Yeah. Hogy. >> I did. Yeah. Hogy. >> I did. Yeah. Hogy. >> No kidding. Yeah. Um he and I have >> No kidding. Yeah. Um he and I have >> No kidding. Yeah. Um he and I have become friends through the years. Uh he become friends through the years. Uh he become friends through the years. Uh he was deployed in Iraq and he got a was deployed in Iraq and he got a was deployed in Iraq and he got a medical discharge which was medical discharge which was medical discharge which was heartbreaking for him and his family
17:00heartbreaking for him and his family heartbreaking for him and his family because um as you pointed out he suffers because um as you pointed out he suffers because um as you pointed out he suffers from MS, multiple sclerosis. At one from MS, multiple sclerosis. At one from MS, multiple sclerosis. At one point back in San Diego, he was point back in San Diego, he was point back in San Diego, he was wheelchair bound. So he's got these wheelchair bound. So he's got these wheelchair bound. So he's got these little kids and he's got a pregnant wife little kids and he's got a pregnant wife little kids and he's got a pregnant wife and and she's wheeling him through and and she's wheeling him through and and she's wheeling him through whatever it was the Walmart or the whatever it was the Walmart or the whatever it was the Walmart or the Target or something. He says MS is an Target or something. He says MS is an Target or something. He says MS is an invisible disease. People might look at invisible disease. People might look at invisible disease. People might look at him and they see a young guy and he's him and they see a young guy and he's him and they see a young guy and he's fairly fit and he's wondering why is fairly fit and he's wondering why is fairly fit and he's wondering why is this pregnant woman wheeling him around this pregnant woman wheeling him around this pregnant woman wheeling him around but he'd reached such a point of um but he'd reached such a point of um but he'd reached such a point of um debilitation and there was nothing that debilitation and there was nothing that debilitation and there was nothing that the doctors at this point he's still the doctors at this point he's still the doctors at this point he's still active duty although obviously he can't active duty although obviously he can't active duty although obviously he can't perform any of those duties but there perform any of those duties but there perform any of those duties but there was none nothing that the doctors at the was none nothing that the doctors at the was none nothing that the doctors at the Navy could do for him. He's getting what Navy could do for him. He's getting what Navy could do for him. He's getting what amounts to a chemotherapy and it isn't amounts to a chemotherapy and it isn't amounts to a chemotherapy and it isn't helping. He starts googling around helping. He starts googling around helping. He starts googling around online and he found out that cold online and he found out that cold online and he found out that cold therapy has been helpful to people with therapy has been helpful to people with therapy has been helpful to people with MS. He bought a broken freezer. He fixed MS. He bought a broken freezer. He fixed MS. He bought a broken freezer. He fixed it by replacing a relay and he started
18:00it by replacing a relay and he started it by replacing a relay and he started getting in. That meant he could walk getting in. That meant he could walk getting in. That meant he could walk again. That meant he could work out again. That meant he could work out again. That meant he could work out again. Then he contacted me and said, "I again. Then he contacted me and said, "I again. Then he contacted me and said, "I think if we work together, we could think if we work together, we could think if we work together, we could write a grant to the Navy Seal write a grant to the Navy Seal write a grant to the Navy Seal Foundation and maybe get me a Morasco." Foundation and maybe get me a Morasco." Foundation and maybe get me a Morasco." So we did. He's been a terrific customer So we did. He's been a terrific customer So we did. He's been a terrific customer ever since. I had to write a couple of ever since. I had to write a couple of ever since. I had to write a couple of articles. I had to understand better the articles. I had to understand better the articles. I had to understand better the science of what was going on. It turns science of what was going on. It turns science of what was going on. It turns out there are 17 FDA approved drugs for out there are 17 FDA approved drugs for out there are 17 FDA approved drugs for multiple sclerosis. None of them address multiple sclerosis. None of them address multiple sclerosis. None of them address the core features of the disease. None the core features of the disease. None the core features of the disease. None of them will reverse the disease. None of them will reverse the disease. None of them will reverse the disease. None of them are a cure. And none of them of them are a cure. And none of them of them are a cure. And none of them work anywhere near as well for work anywhere near as well for work anywhere near as well for management of the symptoms as cold management of the symptoms as cold management of the symptoms as cold plunge therapy will. So now Justin is plunge therapy will. So now Justin is plunge therapy will. So now Justin is out there. He's running his 5Ks. He's out there. He's running his 5Ks. He's out there. He's running his 5Ks. He's posting workout videos from his garage. posting workout videos from his garage. posting workout videos from his garage. It's been an incredible transformation It's been an incredible transformation It's been an incredible transformation because he's using the cold plunge. I because he's using the cold plunge. I because he's using the cold plunge. I went out to visit him in Texas. It's went out to visit him in Texas. It's went out to visit him in Texas. It's getting to be kind of a long story, but getting to be kind of a long story, but getting to be kind of a long story, but I introduced him to Kirk Parsley, whom
19:00I introduced him to Kirk Parsley, whom I introduced him to Kirk Parsley, whom you might know. He was living in Austin you might know. He was living in Austin you might know. He was living in Austin at the time. And Kirk, also a former at the time. And Kirk, also a former at the time. And Kirk, also a former Navy Seal and a physician to the Navy Navy Seal and a physician to the Navy Navy Seal and a physician to the Navy Seals, said Justin might have two Seals, said Justin might have two Seals, said Justin might have two problems. MS, yes, but he also might problems. MS, yes, but he also might problems. MS, yes, but he also might have traumatic brain injury. Because have traumatic brain injury. Because have traumatic brain injury. Because when Justin told him about some of the when Justin told him about some of the when Justin told him about some of the incidents during his deployment in Iraq, incidents during his deployment in Iraq, incidents during his deployment in Iraq, it was clear that he was subjective to it was clear that he was subjective to it was clear that he was subjective to powerful concussion waves or or sorry, powerful concussion waves or or sorry, powerful concussion waves or or sorry, precussion waves. So these are blast precussion waves. So these are blast precussion waves. So these are blast waves. And rather than being, you know, waves. And rather than being, you know, waves. And rather than being, you know, knocked on the head with a hammer or knocked on the head with a hammer or knocked on the head with a hammer or something, what people ordinarily would something, what people ordinarily would something, what people ordinarily would think of as like a football concussion, think of as like a football concussion, think of as like a football concussion, these percussion waves, they move for these percussion waves, they move for these percussion waves, they move for the brain. They rip sections apart the brain. They rip sections apart the brain. They rip sections apart without showing up as a an acute injury without showing up as a an acute injury without showing up as a an acute injury to just one section. What we realized to just one section. What we realized to just one section. What we realized was that the cold helps protect and was that the cold helps protect and was that the cold helps protect and recover from traumatic brain injury as recover from traumatic brain injury as recover from traumatic brain injury as well. Justin didn't know when he was well. Justin didn't know when he was well. Justin didn't know when he was diagnosed with MS that masked the fact
20:00diagnosed with MS that masked the fact diagnosed with MS that masked the fact that he was also trying to recover from that he was also trying to recover from that he was also trying to recover from traumatic brain injury. He never really traumatic brain injury. He never really traumatic brain injury. He never really got that diagnosis until he sat down and got that diagnosis until he sat down and got that diagnosis until he sat down and and talked with Kirk about it. And he and talked with Kirk about it. And he and talked with Kirk about it. And he was already doing one of the super was already doing one of the super was already doing one of the super important things which is get yourself important things which is get yourself important things which is get yourself into the ice bath, boost your FGF-21, into the ice bath, boost your FGF-21, into the ice bath, boost your FGF-21, boost your brain derived neuroprotective boost your brain derived neuroprotective boost your brain derived neuroprotective factor, uh help restructure, recreate factor, uh help restructure, recreate factor, uh help restructure, recreate the neurons. And it was Joe Dtori, who the neurons. And it was Joe Dtori, who the neurons. And it was Joe Dtori, who is a former Navy Seal diver and now a is a former Navy Seal diver and now a is a former Navy Seal diver and now a PhD specializing hyperbaric therapy who PhD specializing hyperbaric therapy who PhD specializing hyperbaric therapy who healed himself in his own brain injury healed himself in his own brain injury healed himself in his own brain injury who clued me into this saying red light who clued me into this saying red light who clued me into this saying red light hyperbaric and cold will promote brain hyperbaric and cold will promote brain hyperbaric and cold will promote brain health. I had no idea that you and health. I had no idea that you and health. I had no idea that you and Justin, you know, go way back before his Justin, you know, go way back before his Justin, you know, go way back before his injury, go way back before uh his injury, go way back before uh his injury, go way back before uh his diagnosis. And that goes to show what a diagnosis. And that goes to show what a diagnosis. And that goes to show what a small world it is. small world it is. small world it is. >> Yeah, it is small. Yeah, I think we met >> Yeah, it is small. Yeah, I think we met >> Yeah, it is small. Yeah, I think we met when we were uh 18 18 19. He was a young when we were uh 18 18 19. He was a young when we were uh 18 18 19. He was a young guy like I was just Yeah. joining the guy like I was just Yeah. joining the guy like I was just Yeah. joining the Navy. So, it is pretty cool. And I was
21:00Navy. So, it is pretty cool. And I was Navy. So, it is pretty cool. And I was actually just able to follow up with him actually just able to follow up with him actually just able to follow up with him a couple weeks ago and now he's like um a couple weeks ago and now he's like um a couple weeks ago and now he's like um he's at the head of mental physical he's at the head of mental physical he's at the head of mental physical health for the Seal Future Foundation. health for the Seal Future Foundation. health for the Seal Future Foundation. So, he's constantly talking to guys um So, he's constantly talking to guys um So, he's constantly talking to guys um about mental health and promoting, you about mental health and promoting, you about mental health and promoting, you know, cold therapy, heat therapy. Um and know, cold therapy, heat therapy. Um and know, cold therapy, heat therapy. Um and so it was really cool to follow up with so it was really cool to follow up with so it was really cool to follow up with him and you know he he talked spoke very him and you know he he talked spoke very him and you know he he talked spoke very highly of you in Morasco and so um highly of you in Morasco and so um highly of you in Morasco and so um connection. Yeah connection. Yeah connection. Yeah >> I feel the same way. He taught me >> I feel the same way. He taught me >> I feel the same way. He taught me something. Um he said he talks to a lot something. Um he said he talks to a lot something. Um he said he talks to a lot of guys uh especially those who are out of guys uh especially those who are out of guys uh especially those who are out the transition leaving active duty and the transition leaving active duty and the transition leaving active duty and becoming a civilian again can be becoming a civilian again can be becoming a civilian again can be extremely stressful because really extremely stressful because really extremely stressful because really nothing about your Navy Seal training is nothing about your Navy Seal training is nothing about your Navy Seal training is going to prepare you for the demands of going to prepare you for the demands of going to prepare you for the demands of civilian life. They're just they're civilian life. They're just they're civilian life. They're just they're completely different worlds. So when completely different worlds. So when completely different worlds. So when guys need help and they wind up guys need help and they wind up guys need help and they wind up contacting Justin, he sensed in them a
22:00contacting Justin, he sensed in them a contacting Justin, he sensed in them a reluctance, he would say, "Well, you reluctance, he would say, "Well, you reluctance, he would say, "Well, you know, I might be having a difficult time know, I might be having a difficult time know, I might be having a difficult time right now, but it's not as bad as this right now, but it's not as bad as this right now, but it's not as bad as this guy or it's not as bad as that guy. You guy or it's not as bad as that guy. You guy or it's not as bad as that guy. You know, probably other guys need more help know, probably other guys need more help know, probably other guys need more help than me." Justin knows that feeling than me." Justin knows that feeling than me." Justin knows that feeling because he's been there. One of the because he's been there. One of the because he's been there. One of the things that he taught me, he will tell things that he taught me, he will tell things that he taught me, he will tell them is, "This is your turn. We're on them is, "This is your turn. We're on them is, "This is your turn. We're on the phone now for you. other guys are the phone now for you. other guys are the phone now for you. other guys are going to have their turns, too. This is going to have their turns, too. This is going to have their turns, too. This is your turn to talk about you. And I your turn to talk about you. And I your turn to talk about you. And I thought that was so powerful because thought that was so powerful because thought that was so powerful because there are there's always somebody who's there are there's always somebody who's there are there's always somebody who's in worse shape or, you know, whatever we in worse shape or, you know, whatever we in worse shape or, you know, whatever we think we're going through, we can think we're going through, we can think we're going through, we can always, I guess, maybe find some always, I guess, maybe find some always, I guess, maybe find some consolation that somebody else has it consolation that somebody else has it consolation that somebody else has it worse. And then that prevents us from worse. And then that prevents us from worse. And then that prevents us from falling into some pity party. falling into some pity party. falling into some pity party. >> But Justin pointed out that we have to >> But Justin pointed out that we have to >> But Justin pointed out that we have to take our turn. We have to take care of take our turn. We have to take care of take our turn. We have to take care of ourselves despite all the other people ourselves despite all the other people ourselves despite all the other people who might be depending upon us. They who might be depending upon us. They who might be depending upon us. They will be helped more when we are strong.
23:00will be helped more when we are strong. will be helped more when we are strong. And um I kept that with me. I mean he And um I kept that with me. I mean he And um I kept that with me. I mean he first explained that to me a couple of first explained that to me a couple of first explained that to me a couple of years ago. I've kept that with me years ago. I've kept that with me years ago. I've kept that with me through some hard times. That's awesome. through some hard times. That's awesome. through some hard times. That's awesome. That's really cool to hear. I feel the That's really cool to hear. I feel the That's really cool to hear. I feel the same way. You know, I feel like it's too same way. You know, I feel like it's too same way. You know, I feel like it's too often um and it's not really talked often um and it's not really talked often um and it's not really talked about as much. I feel like it's kind of about as much. I feel like it's kind of about as much. I feel like it's kind of frowned upon to to talk about it this frowned upon to to talk about it this frowned upon to to talk about it this way, but I feel like u too often, you way, but I feel like u too often, you way, but I feel like u too often, you know, veterans kind of fall into this know, veterans kind of fall into this know, veterans kind of fall into this like victim uh mentality where, you like victim uh mentality where, you like victim uh mentality where, you know, the reality is that they should be know, the reality is that they should be know, the reality is that they should be leaders in the health and wellness leaders in the health and wellness leaders in the health and wellness space. You know, they should be helping, space. You know, they should be helping, space. You know, they should be helping, you know, grow their communities and and you know, grow their communities and and you know, grow their communities and and finding ways to better themselves, you finding ways to better themselves, you finding ways to better themselves, you know, being more proactive. The same know, being more proactive. The same know, being more proactive. The same thing that got them into the military um thing that got them into the military um thing that got them into the military um should be kind of adopted on the back should be kind of adopted on the back should be kind of adopted on the back end, uh in my opinion. And so that's end, uh in my opinion. And so that's end, uh in my opinion. And so that's that's kind of how we uh look at things that's kind of how we uh look at things that's kind of how we uh look at things with like you know the hot box um you with like you know the hot box um you with like you know the hot box um you know the people we hire we hire a lot of know the people we hire we hire a lot of know the people we hire we hire a lot of veterans uh former police officers um to veterans uh former police officers um to veterans uh former police officers um to help us build these saunas you know in help us build these saunas you know in help us build these saunas you know in our m manufacturing facility and um you our m manufacturing facility and um you our m manufacturing facility and um you know I guess just like sharing these
24:00know I guess just like sharing these know I guess just like sharing these skills in traditional carpentry and this skills in traditional carpentry and this skills in traditional carpentry and this you know CNC technology and stuff like you know CNC technology and stuff like you know CNC technology and stuff like that is like a huge part of the business that is like a huge part of the business that is like a huge part of the business that I feel like isn't really talked that I feel like isn't really talked that I feel like isn't really talked about. that's a huge part of our our about. that's a huge part of our our about. that's a huge part of our our brand and our community. Um it's it's a brand and our community. Um it's it's a brand and our community. Um it's it's a way to connect them into the health and way to connect them into the health and way to connect them into the health and wellness space because they have more wellness space because they have more wellness space because they have more purpose, you know, learning these purpose, you know, learning these purpose, you know, learning these skills, building these products for skills, building these products for skills, building these products for people who are investing in themselves, people who are investing in themselves, people who are investing in themselves, for veterans who are looking to get for veterans who are looking to get for veterans who are looking to get better, for, you know, firefighters, better, for, you know, firefighters, better, for, you know, firefighters, police officers, anyone who is exposed police officers, anyone who is exposed police officers, anyone who is exposed to like overly exposed, you know, to to like overly exposed, you know, to to like overly exposed, you know, to blasts or, you know, toxic environments, blasts or, you know, toxic environments, blasts or, you know, toxic environments, um people who serve our communities and um people who serve our communities and um people who serve our communities and stuff like that. And so there's a stuff like that. And so there's a stuff like that. And so there's a extreme level of purpose all the way extreme level of purpose all the way extreme level of purpose all the way down to the shop that we're super proud down to the shop that we're super proud down to the shop that we're super proud of. So of. So of. So >> there's two aspects to this. Um the >> there's two aspects to this. Um the >> there's two aspects to this. Um the first one is first one is first one is >> the best advice you can ever give >> the best advice you can ever give >> the best advice you can ever give somebody is here's what worked for me. somebody is here's what worked for me. somebody is here's what worked for me. Like it it doesn't help to tell people Like it it doesn't help to tell people Like it it doesn't help to tell people what to do, but you can say, you know, I what to do, but you can say, you know, I what to do, but you can say, you know, I was in a similar situation in my life at
25:00was in a similar situation in my life at was in a similar situation in my life at a certain point and I did this kind of a certain point and I did this kind of a certain point and I did this kind of thing and this worked and this wasn't thing and this worked and this wasn't thing and this worked and this wasn't work. And then you let them learn from work. And then you let them learn from work. And then you let them learn from whatever your experience is. So here you whatever your experience is. So here you whatever your experience is. So here you are saying, "Well, you know, I was are saying, "Well, you know, I was are saying, "Well, you know, I was working security for Joe Rogan because I working security for Joe Rogan because I working security for Joe Rogan because I understand weapons. I understand threat. understand weapons. I understand threat. understand weapons. I understand threat. I have good situational awareness. I I have good situational awareness. I I have good situational awareness. I understand teamwork." You could have understand teamwork." You could have understand teamwork." You could have worked security for the rest of your worked security for the rest of your worked security for the rest of your life, but there was some something else, life, but there was some something else, life, but there was some something else, some itch you had to scratch. Uh whether some itch you had to scratch. Uh whether some itch you had to scratch. Uh whether that was the entrepreneurship or that was the entrepreneurship or that was the entrepreneurship or starting a business and you're saying, starting a business and you're saying, starting a business and you're saying, "You know what? Here's something that "You know what? Here's something that "You know what? Here's something that has worked for me. Sona has always made has worked for me. Sona has always made has worked for me. Sona has always made me feel good. I learned more about it in me feel good. I learned more about it in me feel good. I learned more about it in Finland. I'm going to incorporate it Finland. I'm going to incorporate it Finland. I'm going to incorporate it into my life. And then I'm going to help into my life. And then I'm going to help into my life. And then I'm going to help other people who don't have the money to other people who don't have the money to other people who don't have the money to rewire their home onto 220, who aren't rewire their home onto 220, who aren't rewire their home onto 220, who aren't going to buy this huge thing that takes going to buy this huge thing that takes going to buy this huge thing that takes up so much room, but want to get some up so much room, but want to get some up so much room, but want to get some heat in their life. So, that's a heat in their life. So, that's a heat in their life. So, that's a wonderful way um to approach I want to wonderful way um to approach I want to wonderful way um to approach I want to say not giving people advice, but say not giving people advice, but say not giving people advice, but showing people things that work. Here's
26:00showing people things that work. Here's showing people things that work. Here's the other thing that comes up in what the other thing that comes up in what the other thing that comes up in what you're saying. It is so dang hard to run you're saying. It is so dang hard to run you're saying. It is so dang hard to run a manufacturing business in the United a manufacturing business in the United a manufacturing business in the United States. You were talking about the States. You were talking about the States. You were talking about the people that you hire and some of them people that you hire and some of them people that you hire and some of them need skills whether that's uh CNC uh need skills whether that's uh CNC uh need skills whether that's uh CNC uh type skills and this is great. They type skills and this is great. They type skills and this is great. They might be motivated and they might just might be motivated and they might just might be motivated and they might just not know but they're competing against I not know but they're competing against I not know but they're competing against I don't know another here's an impolite don't know another here's an impolite don't know another here's an impolite way to put it. They're competing against way to put it. They're competing against way to put it. They're competing against Chinese slaves. They're competing Chinese slaves. They're competing Chinese slaves. They're competing against people who are working for less against people who are working for less against people who are working for less than a dollar an hour and have no choice than a dollar an hour and have no choice than a dollar an hour and have no choice about it. You can go, I say you, anyone about it. You can go, I say you, anyone about it. You can go, I say you, anyone can go on Alibaba and they can type Sona can go on Alibaba and they can type Sona can go on Alibaba and they can type Sona and there's going to be a thousand and there's going to be a thousand and there's going to be a thousand products that will drop ship from China products that will drop ship from China products that will drop ship from China and they will be onetenth the cost of and they will be onetenth the cost of and they will be onetenth the cost of what a Americanmade sona is going to what a Americanmade sona is going to what a Americanmade sona is going to cost. I know this because the same thing cost. I know this because the same thing cost. I know this because the same thing is true for ice bath. The cheapest way is true for ice bath. The cheapest way is true for ice bath. The cheapest way to get yourself a cold plunge is to go to get yourself a cold plunge is to go to get yourself a cold plunge is to go on Alibaba and buy one of those Chinese on Alibaba and buy one of those Chinese on Alibaba and buy one of those Chinese machines that only costs a few hundred. machines that only costs a few hundred. machines that only costs a few hundred. So when we say, well, we've discovered
27:00So when we say, well, we've discovered So when we say, well, we've discovered something, we've created something, something, we've created something, something, we've created something, we've solved a problem for ourselves we've solved a problem for ourselves we've solved a problem for ourselves that we think might also be useful for that we think might also be useful for that we think might also be useful for other people, we say, well, we want to other people, we say, well, we want to other people, we say, well, we want to make it here in the United States with make it here in the United States with make it here in the United States with people who are happy to have these jobs. people who are happy to have these jobs. people who are happy to have these jobs. Good lord, Brady, there is an avalanche Good lord, Brady, there is an avalanche Good lord, Brady, there is an avalanche of difficulties and competition and of difficulties and competition and of difficulties and competition and problems that come down upon our heads problems that come down upon our heads problems that come down upon our heads because we still want to do because we still want to do because we still want to do manufacturing in the United States. I manufacturing in the United States. I manufacturing in the United States. I think offline you and I have compared a think offline you and I have compared a think offline you and I have compared a few notes and I want to invite you to few notes and I want to invite you to few notes and I want to invite you to share with the audience if you can some share with the audience if you can some share with the audience if you can some of the challenges that you face. of the challenges that you face. of the challenges that you face. >> Yeah, absolutely. I feel like it's um >> Yeah, absolutely. I feel like it's um >> Yeah, absolutely. I feel like it's um it's a question that I always get asked it's a question that I always get asked it's a question that I always get asked is like are you worried about pricing is like are you worried about pricing is like are you worried about pricing yourself out with like because you know yourself out with like because you know yourself out with like because you know it's our our sauna aren't cheap um and it's our our sauna aren't cheap um and it's our our sauna aren't cheap um and that's because of the material we use that's because of the material we use that's because of the material we use because the way we build them and I rely because the way we build them and I rely because the way we build them and I rely heavily on our storytelling and our heavily on our storytelling and our heavily on our storytelling and our branding really just showing people who branding really just showing people who branding really just showing people who we are um as authentically as possible we are um as authentically as possible we are um as authentically as possible and showing the shop showing the people and showing the shop showing the people and showing the shop showing the people who are actually working there um being
28:00who are actually working there um being who are actually working there um being transparent about our costs our material transparent about our costs our material transparent about our costs our material you know supporting our domestic supply you know supporting our domestic supply you know supporting our domestic supply chain all the way through becoming chain all the way through becoming chain all the way through becoming obsessed with sourcing everything we can obsessed with sourcing everything we can obsessed with sourcing everything we can in the United States down to like the in the United States down to like the in the United States down to like the finishing nails. Um, and then just finishing nails. Um, and then just finishing nails. Um, and then just really like flushing out all of our really like flushing out all of our really like flushing out all of our relationships that we have like with our relationships that we have like with our relationships that we have like with our vendors and suppliers like our wood vendors and suppliers like our wood vendors and suppliers like our wood people, our our metal people, like people, our our metal people, like people, our our metal people, like they're all just now part of our family. they're all just now part of our family. they're all just now part of our family. It took us a while to find these people, It took us a while to find these people, It took us a while to find these people, but um I feel like you know we're but um I feel like you know we're but um I feel like you know we're definitely not for everyone. Like not definitely not for everyone. Like not definitely not for everyone. Like not everyone can afford our sauna. We everyone can afford our sauna. We everyone can afford our sauna. We weren't, our goal wasn't to make the weren't, our goal wasn't to make the weren't, our goal wasn't to make the most affordable, cheapest uh sauna on most affordable, cheapest uh sauna on most affordable, cheapest uh sauna on the market. And to your point, you know, the market. And to your point, you know, the market. And to your point, you know, you can scroll through Alibaba and and you can scroll through Alibaba and and you can scroll through Alibaba and and find something that might work for you. find something that might work for you. find something that might work for you. And we actually encourage people to And we actually encourage people to And we actually encourage people to build their own saunas, their own build their own saunas, their own build their own saunas, their own cockpit style sauna um from materials cockpit style sauna um from materials cockpit style sauna um from materials that you could find from Home Depot. that you could find from Home Depot. that you could find from Home Depot. That's how I started building um the hot That's how I started building um the hot That's how I started building um the hot boxes. And so we're always encouraging boxes. And so we're always encouraging boxes. And so we're always encouraging people to go that route. But we know people to go that route. But we know people to go that route. But we know that for our customers, they're that for our customers, they're that for our customers, they're investing in a product. They trust us
29:00investing in a product. They trust us investing in a product. They trust us once they get through the process of once they get through the process of once they get through the process of seeing, you know, who we are, every nook seeing, you know, who we are, every nook seeing, you know, who we are, every nook and cranny of the shop. And we know and cranny of the shop. And we know and cranny of the shop. And we know that, you know, $5,000, $4,900 is is a that, you know, $5,000, $4,900 is is a that, you know, $5,000, $4,900 is is a is an investment. And we just want to is an investment. And we just want to is an investment. And we just want to make sure that our customers are, you make sure that our customers are, you make sure that our customers are, you know, there's no buyer's remorse on the know, there's no buyer's remorse on the know, there's no buyer's remorse on the back end. We want to make sure that they back end. We want to make sure that they back end. We want to make sure that they have like a very confident purchase and have like a very confident purchase and have like a very confident purchase and they have a tool that's going to serve they have a tool that's going to serve they have a tool that's going to serve them and their families for the rest of them and their families for the rest of them and their families for the rest of their lives. And so, um, a big part, and their lives. And so, um, a big part, and their lives. And so, um, a big part, and this was through like, um, a few this was through like, um, a few this was through like, um, a few different mentors of mine just like when different mentors of mine just like when different mentors of mine just like when it came to like actually building it, it came to like actually building it, it came to like actually building it, building the company, one of my main building the company, one of my main building the company, one of my main focuses was building it as robust as we focuses was building it as robust as we focuses was building it as robust as we possibly could, you know, while keeping possibly could, you know, while keeping possibly could, you know, while keeping it still sleek and sexy, keeping the it still sleek and sexy, keeping the it still sleek and sexy, keeping the design there. But one of the main things design there. But one of the main things design there. But one of the main things I focus on was building it out like a I focus on was building it out like a I focus on was building it out like a tank there. Therefore, we wouldn't have tank there. Therefore, we wouldn't have tank there. Therefore, we wouldn't have any as much if any customer service on any as much if any customer service on any as much if any customer service on the back end. And so, that was like the the back end. And so, that was like the the back end. And so, that was like the main focus there is that we wanted it to main focus there is that we wanted it to main focus there is that we wanted it to be solid. That way, we could frontload
30:00be solid. That way, we could frontload be solid. That way, we could frontload all of our efforts and not have, you all of our efforts and not have, you all of our efforts and not have, you know, be stretched too thin. Now, we're know, be stretched too thin. Now, we're know, be stretched too thin. Now, we're running a customer service company and a running a customer service company and a running a customer service company and a marketing company and a manufacturing marketing company and a manufacturing marketing company and a manufacturing company. It's right now it's just a company. It's right now it's just a company. It's right now it's just a manufacturing, marketing, sales company. manufacturing, marketing, sales company. manufacturing, marketing, sales company. And so, um, that was one of the main And so, um, that was one of the main And so, um, that was one of the main focuses there. And it's definitely paid focuses there. And it's definitely paid focuses there. And it's definitely paid off, but, you know, it's we we've off, but, you know, it's we we've off, but, you know, it's we we've created some competition for, you know, created some competition for, you know, created some competition for, you know, for ourselves with, um, certain for ourselves with, um, certain for ourselves with, um, certain companies that are replicating our companies that are replicating our companies that are replicating our design. And so, there is a question on design. And so, there is a question on design. And so, there is a question on whether or not we have are are going to whether or not we have are are going to whether or not we have are are going to price ourselves out. But we just believe price ourselves out. But we just believe price ourselves out. But we just believe in, you know, our community, staying in, you know, our community, staying in, you know, our community, staying true to who we are, prioritizing our true to who we are, prioritizing our true to who we are, prioritizing our customers, and just continue to build customers, and just continue to build customers, and just continue to build this like kind of a slow authentic this like kind of a slow authentic this like kind of a slow authentic company. We build them in batches. You company. We build them in batches. You company. We build them in batches. You know, we're we're really focused on know, we're we're really focused on know, we're we're really focused on quality and we know that when our quality and we know that when our quality and we know that when our customers show up, they're they're fully customers show up, they're they're fully customers show up, they're they're fully committed into us and who we are and committed into us and who we are and committed into us and who we are and everything that we stand for. So, it's everything that we stand for. So, it's everything that we stand for. So, it's more than just a purchase for them, for more than just a purchase for them, for more than just a purchase for them, for our customers for the most part. It's
31:00our customers for the most part. It's our customers for the most part. It's not an impulse buy. not an impulse buy. not an impulse buy. Some people say, "Why should I pay more Some people say, "Why should I pay more Some people say, "Why should I pay more for Morosco if I could get a competing for Morosco if I could get a competing for Morosco if I could get a competing product for thousands of dollars less?" product for thousands of dollars less?" product for thousands of dollars less?" And it is thousands of dollars. Um, what And it is thousands of dollars. Um, what And it is thousands of dollars. Um, what I tell them is the most important thing I tell them is the most important thing I tell them is the most important thing is that you feel 100% comfortable with is that you feel 100% comfortable with is that you feel 100% comfortable with the people from whom you're buying. the people from whom you're buying. the people from whom you're buying. And they realize that when they click on And they realize that when they click on And they realize that when they click on an ad that says it's the ultimate an ad that says it's the ultimate an ad that says it's the ultimate innovation in technology for ice bath innovation in technology for ice bath innovation in technology for ice bath machine innovation ultimate revolution machine innovation ultimate revolution machine innovation ultimate revolution and it's $1,500 off. They're attracted and it's $1,500 off. They're attracted and it's $1,500 off. They're attracted to the price, but they know that the ad to the price, but they know that the ad to the price, but they know that the ad is full of crap. They know that the is full of crap. They know that the is full of crap. They know that the business model in that ad is to try and business model in that ad is to try and business model in that ad is to try and fool customers into purchasing the ad or fool customers into purchasing the ad or fool customers into purchasing the ad or in purchasing the product without in purchasing the product without in purchasing the product without looking at the warranty or the terms of looking at the warranty or the terms of looking at the warranty or the terms of service or anything like that. We take a service or anything like that. We take a service or anything like that. We take a very similar approach to you. Uh ours is
32:00very similar approach to you. Uh ours is very similar approach to you. Uh ours is built like a tank and some people object built like a tank and some people object built like a tank and some people object to that aesthetic. The thick wood frame, to that aesthetic. The thick wood frame, to that aesthetic. The thick wood frame, the fact that it weighs 350 lbs. When we the fact that it weighs 350 lbs. When we the fact that it weighs 350 lbs. When we built it, built it, built it, >> we wanted you to, you know, be able to >> we wanted you to, you know, be able to >> we wanted you to, you know, be able to accidentally drop a kettle bell on it or accidentally drop a kettle bell on it or accidentally drop a kettle bell on it or accidentally hit it with a steel mace or accidentally hit it with a steel mace or accidentally hit it with a steel mace or something and it doesn't matter. It'll something and it doesn't matter. It'll something and it doesn't matter. It'll like take a dent and you're not worried like take a dent and you're not worried like take a dent and you're not worried about it because it's tough. This is why about it because it's tough. This is why about it because it's tough. This is why the hot box and Morasco aesthetically the hot box and Morasco aesthetically the hot box and Morasco aesthetically they go together very well. The they go together very well. The they go together very well. The alternative is one of these cheap alternative is one of these cheap alternative is one of these cheap infrared ones that's really made of infrared ones that's really made of infrared ones that's really made of glass and it has a thin wood veneer glass and it has a thin wood veneer glass and it has a thin wood veneer frame and that's good for flat packing frame and that's good for flat packing frame and that's good for flat packing it from China and then people assemble it from China and then people assemble it from China and then people assemble it but heaven forbid you hang the door it but heaven forbid you hang the door it but heaven forbid you hang the door because it's never going to quite keep because it's never going to quite keep because it's never going to quite keep the fit that you got it when you got it the fit that you got it when you got it the fit that you got it when you got it straight. It's the kind of thing that straight. It's the kind of thing that straight. It's the kind of thing that you might use for a couple of three you might use for a couple of three you might use for a couple of three years just to try out and see whether years just to try out and see whether years just to try out and see whether you enjoy a sauna. A lot of our
33:00you enjoy a sauna. A lot of our you enjoy a sauna. A lot of our competitors are like that. People will competitors are like that. People will competitors are like that. People will buy an inflatable or a popup. They don't buy an inflatable or a popup. They don't buy an inflatable or a popup. They don't know if they really want a cold plunge know if they really want a cold plunge know if they really want a cold plunge and so they'll get something cheap. When and so they'll get something cheap. When and so they'll get something cheap. When they commit and they say, "This is they commit and they say, "This is they commit and they say, "This is something I'm going to do for the rest something I'm going to do for the rest something I'm going to do for the rest of my life because I want to live a long of my life because I want to live a long of my life because I want to live a long healthy time." then they might be ready healthy time." then they might be ready healthy time." then they might be ready to buy a moras coat. to buy a moras coat. to buy a moras coat. >> Heck yeah. And I' I'd kind of compare it >> Heck yeah. And I' I'd kind of compare it >> Heck yeah. And I' I'd kind of compare it to like, you know, when you if you're to like, you know, when you if you're to like, you know, when you if you're thinking about playing the guitar, you thinking about playing the guitar, you thinking about playing the guitar, you might play a cheap one for a while and might play a cheap one for a while and might play a cheap one for a while and then when you really like cross over then when you really like cross over then when you really like cross over into, you know, learning how to play into, you know, learning how to play into, you know, learning how to play properly, I think that's when you're properly, I think that's when you're properly, I think that's when you're buying like a tailor and it's going to buying like a tailor and it's going to buying like a tailor and it's going to encourage you to just jump on the guitar encourage you to just jump on the guitar encourage you to just jump on the guitar more and more. It sounds better. It more and more. It sounds better. It more and more. It sounds better. It feels better. Um, and I feel like with feels better. Um, and I feel like with feels better. Um, and I feel like with with my generation, they're definitely with my generation, they're definitely with my generation, they're definitely waking up. you can tell that they're waking up. you can tell that they're waking up. you can tell that they're starting to uh prioritize their spending starting to uh prioritize their spending starting to uh prioritize their spending habits. You know, it's less on like, you habits. You know, it's less on like, you habits. You know, it's less on like, you know, these all-inclusive resorts where know, these all-inclusive resorts where know, these all-inclusive resorts where you go out and like party, drink, um you go out and like party, drink, um you go out and like party, drink, um whatever. whatever. whatever. >> Money's gone. >> Money's gone. >> Money's gone. >> Yep. >> Yep. >> Yep. >> Yeah. The money's gone. And um really,
34:00>> Yeah. The money's gone. And um really, >> Yeah. The money's gone. And um really, you know, you feel like [ __ ] for it. And you know, you feel like [ __ ] for it. And you know, you feel like [ __ ] for it. And more so now, I feel like, you know, my more so now, I feel like, you know, my more so now, I feel like, you know, my generation is prioritizing like certain generation is prioritizing like certain generation is prioritizing like certain tools to, you know, uh build out their tools to, you know, uh build out their tools to, you know, uh build out their like I call them like COVID compounds like I call them like COVID compounds like I call them like COVID compounds or, you know, wellness compounds. um you or, you know, wellness compounds. um you or, you know, wellness compounds. um you need these specific tools and then they need these specific tools and then they need these specific tools and then they end up paying for themselves tenfold end up paying for themselves tenfold end up paying for themselves tenfold with how how your mood is affected by with how how your mood is affected by with how how your mood is affected by it, how much better you're able to it, how much better you're able to it, how much better you're able to perform in what you're doing. Um better, perform in what you're doing. Um better, perform in what you're doing. Um better, you know, leader of your family unit or you know, leader of your family unit or you know, leader of your family unit or your community because of these tools. your community because of these tools. your community because of these tools. And so, um that's really cool to see. And so, um that's really cool to see. And so, um that's really cool to see. So, it's not just So, it's not just So, it's not just >> I knew a mom who um she was trying to >> I knew a mom who um she was trying to >> I knew a mom who um she was trying to explain why she cold plunged and she's explain why she cold plunged and she's explain why she cold plunged and she's got four daughters and she wrote out a got four daughters and she wrote out a got four daughters and she wrote out a little essay to herself and then little essay to herself and then little essay to herself and then eventually we put it up on Instagram. eventually we put it up on Instagram. eventually we put it up on Instagram. She said, "Look, I'm not a model, you She said, "Look, I'm not a model, you She said, "Look, I'm not a model, you know, I'm not an elite athlete. I'm not know, I'm not an elite athlete. I'm not know, I'm not an elite athlete. I'm not trying to recover from my ultrarathon
35:00trying to recover from my ultrarathon trying to recover from my ultrarathon training or whatever it was. I'm not training or whatever it was. I'm not training or whatever it was. I'm not trying to, you know, suck people into my trying to, you know, suck people into my trying to, you know, suck people into my Instagram account to follow me and then Instagram account to follow me and then Instagram account to follow me and then sell them stuff like that. She goes, I sell them stuff like that. She goes, I sell them stuff like that. She goes, I cold plunge because the woman who gets cold plunge because the woman who gets cold plunge because the woman who gets out of the cold plunge is better than out of the cold plunge is better than out of the cold plunge is better than the woman who got in. And she wants to the woman who got in. And she wants to the woman who got in. And she wants to be an example to her daughters to show be an example to her daughters to show be an example to her daughters to show her daughters that she can do hard her daughters that she can do hard her daughters that she can do hard things and so can they. the boost that things and so can they. the boost that things and so can they. the boost that you get in confidence, in what I call you get in confidence, in what I call you get in confidence, in what I call resilience, in productivity, from doing resilience, in productivity, from doing resilience, in productivity, from doing these difficult things every morning. these difficult things every morning. these difficult things every morning. You know, Joe says no negotiation, just You know, Joe says no negotiation, just You know, Joe says no negotiation, just get into the cold blood. You do the get into the cold blood. You do the get into the cold blood. You do the difficult thing. And when you come out difficult thing. And when you come out difficult thing. And when you come out of that hard thing, nothing bothers you of that hard thing, nothing bothers you of that hard thing, nothing bothers you anymore. And so, this is part of it is anymore. And so, this is part of it is anymore. And so, this is part of it is your turn. It is your turn to take care your turn. It is your turn to take care your turn. It is your turn to take care of yourself. You're going to face your of yourself. You're going to face your of yourself. You're going to face your challenges right here in your moment so challenges right here in your moment so challenges right here in your moment so you can be stronger for all the other you can be stronger for all the other you can be stronger for all the other people who are depending upon you.
36:00people who are depending upon you. people who are depending upon you. Heck yeah. And that's it's funny you Heck yeah. And that's it's funny you Heck yeah. And that's it's funny you mentioned that because like in the mentioned that because like in the mentioned that because like in the beginning when I was building the the beginning when I was building the the beginning when I was building the the hot box, I was so obsessed with the hot box, I was so obsessed with the hot box, I was so obsessed with the design and the performance like what it design and the performance like what it design and the performance like what it is. And I I kind of lost track of what is. And I I kind of lost track of what is. And I I kind of lost track of what it does and I wasn't really expecting or it does and I wasn't really expecting or it does and I wasn't really expecting or I was kind of sleeping on the the fact I was kind of sleeping on the the fact I was kind of sleeping on the the fact that like it was building a community. that like it was building a community. that like it was building a community. Um I wasn't as focused on like the brand Um I wasn't as focused on like the brand Um I wasn't as focused on like the brand and our community in the beginning. Uh and our community in the beginning. Uh and our community in the beginning. Uh more so about how do we streamline more so about how do we streamline more so about how do we streamline manufacturing? How do we make sure the manufacturing? How do we make sure the manufacturing? How do we make sure the workflow is perfect and the product is workflow is perfect and the product is workflow is perfect and the product is you know the best product we could you know the best product we could you know the best product we could possibly launch. And now it's like a possibly launch. And now it's like a possibly launch. And now it's like a whole new level of purpose for me seeing whole new level of purpose for me seeing whole new level of purpose for me seeing the feedback from our community. Like the feedback from our community. Like the feedback from our community. Like there's so many of our our customers there's so many of our our customers there's so many of our our customers that give us the feedback of like you that give us the feedback of like you that give us the feedback of like you know they're either putting something in know they're either putting something in know they're either putting something in remission or it's changed their life remission or it's changed their life remission or it's changed their life within the first session. you know, it's within the first session. you know, it's within the first session. you know, it's like that we always hear like a like like that we always hear like a like like that we always hear like a like commentary or a testimonial after like commentary or a testimonial after like commentary or a testimonial after like the first night of sleep and um or or
37:00the first night of sleep and um or or the first night of sleep and um or or just like unconventional ways to treat just like unconventional ways to treat just like unconventional ways to treat um people who are, you know, getting um people who are, you know, getting um people who are, you know, getting chemo treatment, you know, battling chemo treatment, you know, battling chemo treatment, you know, battling cancer. Uh my mother being one of them, cancer. Uh my mother being one of them, cancer. Uh my mother being one of them, like she was diagnosed with ovarian like she was diagnosed with ovarian like she was diagnosed with ovarian cancer. My my brother moved in with her cancer. My my brother moved in with her cancer. My my brother moved in with her um as she was going through her chemo um as she was going through her chemo um as she was going through her chemo treatment, built her a hot box, like one treatment, built her a hot box, like one treatment, built her a hot box, like one of the first five off the line. and my of the first five off the line. and my of the first five off the line. and my my brother stuck her in the sauna every my brother stuck her in the sauna every my brother stuck her in the sauna every single day. It was like the only way for single day. It was like the only way for single day. It was like the only way for her to find like relief in the symptoms. her to find like relief in the symptoms. her to find like relief in the symptoms. >> But um there's so much compelling >> But um there's so much compelling >> But um there's so much compelling evidence and I'm sure you know when evidence and I'm sure you know when evidence and I'm sure you know when worked in parallel with chemo treatment worked in parallel with chemo treatment worked in parallel with chemo treatment uh with red light with infrared with uh with red light with infrared with uh with red light with infrared with high temperatures traditional high temperatures traditional high temperatures traditional temperatures um it is just it's it's the temperatures um it is just it's it's the temperatures um it is just it's it's the best tool to combat um cancer you know best tool to combat um cancer you know best tool to combat um cancer you know in parallel with chemo treatment. And so in parallel with chemo treatment. And so in parallel with chemo treatment. And so I'm fully convinced that it saved my I'm fully convinced that it saved my I'm fully convinced that it saved my mom's life. And we've had so many mom's life. And we've had so many mom's life. And we've had so many different um stories like that with different um stories like that with different um stories like that with like, you know, parents buying hot boxes like, you know, parents buying hot boxes like, you know, parents buying hot boxes for their kids that are going through uh
38:00for their kids that are going through uh for their kids that are going through uh chemo treatment and stuff like that. chemo treatment and stuff like that. chemo treatment and stuff like that. Like totally unconventional that would Like totally unconventional that would Like totally unconventional that would be frowned upon like don't stick your be frowned upon like don't stick your be frowned upon like don't stick your kids in a sauna kind of thing, but kids in a sauna kind of thing, but kids in a sauna kind of thing, but they're they're doing it anyways. and they're they're doing it anyways. and they're they're doing it anyways. and the feedback we get, you know, like the the feedback we get, you know, like the the feedback we get, you know, like the the relationships we build with our the relationships we build with our the relationships we build with our customers, like seeing like these kids, customers, like seeing like these kids, customers, like seeing like these kids, you know, playing sports after, you you know, playing sports after, you you know, playing sports after, you know, a year or two of treatment with, know, a year or two of treatment with, know, a year or two of treatment with, you know, Sauna Therapy has completely you know, Sauna Therapy has completely you know, Sauna Therapy has completely changed like my entire like outlook when changed like my entire like outlook when changed like my entire like outlook when it comes to like my drive and building it comes to like my drive and building it comes to like my drive and building the brand and continuing to get this the brand and continuing to get this the brand and continuing to get this word out there more um and and less word out there more um and and less word out there more um and and less about like what the product actually is about like what the product actually is about like what the product actually is and more about what it does and the and more about what it does and the and more about what it does and the community that we're building. It was so community that we're building. It was so community that we're building. It was so overlooked in the beginning. overlooked in the beginning. overlooked in the beginning. There are two aspects to this. One is There are two aspects to this. One is There are two aspects to this. One is there's a research project going on in there's a research project going on in there's a research project going on in Vale, Colorado looking at sauna and Vale, Colorado looking at sauna and Vale, Colorado looking at sauna and comparing it to thermal contrast comparing it to thermal contrast comparing it to thermal contrast therapy. So sauna with cold plunge for therapy. So sauna with cold plunge for therapy. So sauna with cold plunge for mental health. And the reason is that mental health. And the reason is that mental health. And the reason is that there is a huge um community of experts there is a huge um community of experts there is a huge um community of experts in veil who are working at the leading
39:00in veil who are working at the leading in veil who are working at the leading edge of alternative approaches to mental edge of alternative approaches to mental edge of alternative approaches to mental health and their approach is metabolic. health and their approach is metabolic. health and their approach is metabolic. The brain needs functioning The brain needs functioning The brain needs functioning mitochondria. You're depressed. That's a mitochondria. You're depressed. That's a mitochondria. You're depressed. That's a metabolic disorder. And what they metabolic disorder. And what they metabolic disorder. And what they discovered is that people single session discovered is that people single session discovered is that people single session of sona would lift their mood, give them of sona would lift their mood, give them of sona would lift their mood, give them the energy that they needed to face the energy that they needed to face the energy that they needed to face other challenges in the day. Prepare other challenges in the day. Prepare other challenges in the day. Prepare them for talk therapy uh or cognitive them for talk therapy uh or cognitive them for talk therapy uh or cognitive behavioral therapy for example, so that behavioral therapy for example, so that behavioral therapy for example, so that they could get more out of the therapies they could get more out of the therapies they could get more out of the therapies that they had. Now, they're comparing it that they had. Now, they're comparing it that they had. Now, they're comparing it to sauna in combination with cold plunge to sauna in combination with cold plunge to sauna in combination with cold plunge because there's really good evidence because there's really good evidence because there's really good evidence that cold plunge has done the same that cold plunge has done the same that cold plunge has done the same thing. I've posted a couple of articles. thing. I've posted a couple of articles. thing. I've posted a couple of articles. One of the things that an ice bath or One of the things that an ice bath or One of the things that an ice bath or winter swimming will do is stimulate winter swimming will do is stimulate winter swimming will do is stimulate mitobiogenesis. mitobiogenesis. mitobiogenesis. The brain is the most metabolically The brain is the most metabolically The brain is the most metabolically demanding organ in the body. And when demanding organ in the body. And when demanding organ in the body. And when your metabolism metabolism isn't right, your metabolism metabolism isn't right, your metabolism metabolism isn't right, your brain won't work properly. It is no your brain won't work properly. It is no your brain won't work properly. It is no wonder you lapse into low mood or you
40:00wonder you lapse into low mood or you wonder you lapse into low mood or you have um disordered thoughts and you have um disordered thoughts and you have um disordered thoughts and you can't snap yourself out. The cold fixes can't snap yourself out. The cold fixes can't snap yourself out. The cold fixes that not just with the dopamine or the that not just with the dopamine or the that not just with the dopamine or the noradrenaline or the other noradrenaline or the other noradrenaline or the other neurotransmatters but by fixing the neurotransmatters but by fixing the neurotransmatters but by fixing the metabolism. So sauna and cold together metabolism. So sauna and cold together metabolism. So sauna and cold together may be more effective than either one of may be more effective than either one of may be more effective than either one of them alone, but there's good clinical them alone, but there's good clinical them alone, but there's good clinical and case study evidence that say they and case study evidence that say they and case study evidence that say they are both really good for mental health are both really good for mental health are both really good for mental health because mental health has a strong because mental health has a strong because mental health has a strong metabolic component. Guess what else has metabolic component. Guess what else has metabolic component. Guess what else has a metabolic component? Cancer. Cancer is a metabolic component? Cancer. Cancer is a metabolic component? Cancer. Cancer is a disorder of the metabolism. And it's a disorder of the metabolism. And it's a disorder of the metabolism. And it's not just Thomas Seaffreed who says so. not just Thomas Seaffreed who says so. not just Thomas Seaffreed who says so. Seaff Freed is a Boston College Seaff Freed is a Boston College Seaff Freed is a Boston College professor. He was recently on the diary professor. He was recently on the diary professor. He was recently on the diary of a CEO podcast and he was explaining of a CEO podcast and he was explaining of a CEO podcast and he was explaining at a very basic level to to Bartlett how at a very basic level to to Bartlett how at a very basic level to to Bartlett how the mitochondria in the cell are the mitochondria in the cell are the mitochondria in the cell are defective. It is true that cancer is defective. It is true that cancer is defective. It is true that cancer is characterized by mutations in the DNA in characterized by mutations in the DNA in characterized by mutations in the DNA in the nucleus. Not all car cancers but the nucleus. Not all car cancers but
41:00the nucleus. Not all car cancers but most of them. Seafed says that those most of them. Seafed says that those most of them. Seafed says that those defects in the DNA in the nucleus are defects in the DNA in the nucleus are defects in the DNA in the nucleus are downstream of damaged mitochondria. downstream of damaged mitochondria. downstream of damaged mitochondria. There is no cancer with normal There is no cancer with normal There is no cancer with normal mitochondria. Every single case has mitochondria. Every single case has mitochondria. Every single case has defective mitochondria. So fixing the defective mitochondria. So fixing the defective mitochondria. So fixing the mitochondria will improve cancer mitochondria will improve cancer mitochondria will improve cancer treatment outcomes. Guess how you fix treatment outcomes. Guess how you fix treatment outcomes. Guess how you fix the mitochondria? Thermal contrast the mitochondria? Thermal contrast the mitochondria? Thermal contrast therapy is one of the best things you therapy is one of the best things you therapy is one of the best things you can do for your cardiovascular system, can do for your cardiovascular system, can do for your cardiovascular system, for your metabolism, for your for your metabolism, for your for your metabolism, for your mitochondria. And so I'm not surprised mitochondria. And so I'm not surprised mitochondria. And so I'm not surprised to hear that your mother and other to hear that your mother and other to hear that your mother and other people among your customer base are people among your customer base are people among your customer base are using sona to improve their own cancer using sona to improve their own cancer using sona to improve their own cancer treatment outcomes. And it makes me treatment outcomes. And it makes me treatment outcomes. And it makes me think what if we moved them to thermal think what if we moved them to thermal think what if we moved them to thermal contrast therapy. Uh maybe veiled their contrast therapy. Uh maybe veiled their contrast therapy. Uh maybe veiled their studies will show us that we can get an studies will show us that we can get an studies will show us that we can get an even better benefit by layering or sorry even better benefit by layering or sorry even better benefit by layering or sorry stacking these two treatments together. stacking these two treatments together. stacking these two treatments together. >> Absolutely. Yeah. And I I can obviously >> Absolutely. Yeah. And I I can obviously >> Absolutely. Yeah. And I I can obviously just speak on like how it makes me feel. just speak on like how it makes me feel. just speak on like how it makes me feel. And this is why I was so excited to to And this is why I was so excited to to And this is why I was so excited to to have this with you is because you're um
42:00have this with you is because you're um have this with you is because you're um so well educated on everything and the so well educated on everything and the so well educated on everything and the way that you explain it is very way that you explain it is very way that you explain it is very digestible um for for people like digestible um for for people like digestible um for for people like myself. Um so I really appreciate that. myself. Um so I really appreciate that. myself. Um so I really appreciate that. But like you know just speaking on like But like you know just speaking on like But like you know just speaking on like how it makes me feel doing contrast how it makes me feel doing contrast how it makes me feel doing contrast therapy. Um I used to do it more so now therapy. Um I used to do it more so now therapy. Um I used to do it more so now than I uh or I did it more before than I than I uh or I did it more before than I than I uh or I did it more before than I do now. Um, but the way that it makes me do now. Um, but the way that it makes me do now. Um, but the way that it makes me feel is unlike any, um, supplement or feel is unlike any, um, supplement or feel is unlike any, um, supplement or night sleep or um, any other, you know, night sleep or um, any other, you know, night sleep or um, any other, you know, vitamin that I'm taking. It's it's a vitamin that I'm taking. It's it's a vitamin that I'm taking. It's it's a huge way to gain like mental clarity and huge way to gain like mental clarity and huge way to gain like mental clarity and in a quick like hour session, you know, in a quick like hour session, you know, in a quick like hour session, you know, whether it's like 30 minutes in the whether it's like 30 minutes in the whether it's like 30 minutes in the sauna on and off, uh, maybe two, three sauna on and off, uh, maybe two, three sauna on and off, uh, maybe two, three minutes in the cold plunge, and then minutes in the cold plunge, and then minutes in the cold plunge, and then back in the sauna. Um, there has been back in the sauna. Um, there has been back in the sauna. Um, there has been nothing that can even hold a flame to nothing that can even hold a flame to nothing that can even hold a flame to like the feeling that you get from like the feeling that you get from like the feeling that you get from contrast therapy. And so, um, yeah, I I contrast therapy. And so, um, yeah, I I contrast therapy. And so, um, yeah, I I fully believe in it. fully believe in it. fully believe in it. >> Agreed. Although it would be unfair, uh, >> Agreed. Although it would be unfair, uh, >> Agreed. Although it would be unfair, uh, if we didn't admit that there's some if we didn't admit that there's some if we didn't admit that there's some pretty miserable moments along the way.
43:00pretty miserable moments along the way. pretty miserable moments along the way. Uh, when someone first gets into an ice Uh, when someone first gets into an ice Uh, when someone first gets into an ice path, nobody is having fun. Those first path, nobody is having fun. Those first path, nobody is having fun. Those first 15 seconds are awful. And then, you 15 seconds are awful. And then, you 15 seconds are awful. And then, you know, another 15 or 30 seconds go by. In know, another 15 or 30 seconds go by. In know, another 15 or 30 seconds go by. In my experience, it's like, what was I my experience, it's like, what was I my experience, it's like, what was I even worried about? You know, I take even worried about? You know, I take even worried about? You know, I take control of my breathing. The dive reflex control of my breathing. The dive reflex control of my breathing. The dive reflex kicks in. I wind up relaxing and see why kicks in. I wind up relaxing and see why kicks in. I wind up relaxing and see why why do I do this to myself every time I why do I do this to myself every time I why do I do this to myself every time I think it's going to be terrible and I think it's going to be terrible and I think it's going to be terrible and I get so anxious and then I'm like oh I get so anxious and then I'm like oh I get so anxious and then I'm like oh I could stay in here for for five 10 could stay in here for for five 10 could stay in here for for five 10 minutes if I wanted to. I just do two to minutes if I wanted to. I just do two to minutes if I wanted to. I just do two to four minutes. You know you can play a four minutes. You know you can play a four minutes. You know you can play a song on your phone or something and when song on your phone or something and when song on your phone or something and when your pop song is over it's time to come your pop song is over it's time to come your pop song is over it's time to come out. The feeling for me is when I'm out. The feeling for me is when I'm out. The feeling for me is when I'm finished and then I feel like Superman. finished and then I feel like Superman. finished and then I feel like Superman. Sona has a similar effect on me. I get Sona has a similar effect on me. I get Sona has a similar effect on me. I get in there, but it's opposite at first. in there, but it's opposite at first. in there, but it's opposite at first. I'm like, "Oh, this is no problem." You I'm like, "Oh, this is no problem." You I'm like, "Oh, this is no problem." You know, I could stay in here for an hour. know, I could stay in here for an hour. know, I could stay in here for an hour. No big deal. I got to bring a book, you No big deal. I got to bring a book, you No big deal. I got to bring a book, you know, and then it creeps up on me. And know, and then it creeps up on me. And know, and then it creeps up on me. And then I start to sweat. And then I start then I start to sweat. And then I start then I start to sweat. And then I start to feel miserable. And I say, "Hang on a
44:00to feel miserable. And I say, "Hang on a to feel miserable. And I say, "Hang on a second. I'm not running out of here second. I'm not running out of here second. I'm not running out of here right away. I'm going to see if I can right away. I'm going to see if I can right away. I'm going to see if I can stay for another two to four minutes stay for another two to four minutes stay for another two to four minutes past that point where I'm so past that point where I'm so past that point where I'm so uncomfortable. I think I should leave." uncomfortable. I think I should leave." uncomfortable. I think I should leave." It's um emotionally like the trajectory It's um emotionally like the trajectory It's um emotionally like the trajectory of the cold bath is it starts terrible of the cold bath is it starts terrible of the cold bath is it starts terrible and it gets better. The trajectory of and it gets better. The trajectory of and it gets better. The trajectory of the sauna for me is it starts great and the sauna for me is it starts great and the sauna for me is it starts great and then it gets worse and worse. Do you then it gets worse and worse. Do you then it gets worse and worse. Do you have an experience like that? have an experience like that? have an experience like that? >> Oh yeah. It's funny that you bring it up >> Oh yeah. It's funny that you bring it up >> Oh yeah. It's funny that you bring it up because I just uh spoke with one of my because I just uh spoke with one of my because I just uh spoke with one of my buddies um who has been using the hot buddies um who has been using the hot buddies um who has been using the hot box for a while and um he goes they have box for a while and um he goes they have box for a while and um he goes they have a uh traditional sauna at their command a uh traditional sauna at their command a uh traditional sauna at their command and so he will go and use that you know and so he will go and use that you know and so he will go and use that you know with the guys. is more of a social with the guys. is more of a social with the guys. is more of a social setting. And I guess it just doesn't get setting. And I guess it just doesn't get setting. And I guess it just doesn't get as hot. Like it's not as as intense for as hot. Like it's not as as intense for as hot. Like it's not as as intense for him. And he was talking about like the him. And he was talking about like the him. And he was talking about like the and this is obviously like just a way of and this is obviously like just a way of and this is obviously like just a way of self-measuring like um whether or not self-measuring like um whether or not self-measuring like um whether or not like the the sauna the heat therapy is like the the sauna the heat therapy is like the the sauna the heat therapy is is effective is like when it gets to the is effective is like when it gets to the is effective is like when it gets to the point like you mentioned of like selft point like you mentioned of like selft point like you mentioned of like selft talk where you're you're climbing up talk where you're you're climbing up talk where you're you're climbing up your core temperature is rising you know your core temperature is rising you know your core temperature is rising you know without like measuring anything or
45:00without like measuring anything or without like measuring anything or knowing exactly how hot you are um is knowing exactly how hot you are um is knowing exactly how hot you are um is like you know 3 to five minutes past like you know 3 to five minutes past like you know 3 to five minutes past that selft talk moment where you're like that selft talk moment where you're like that selft talk moment where you're like you're at the mental screaming point. Um you're at the mental screaming point. Um you're at the mental screaming point. Um that's what he was talking about for me. that's what he was talking about for me. that's what he was talking about for me. We were just kind of chatting it up, but We were just kind of chatting it up, but We were just kind of chatting it up, but he was saying that like the big he was saying that like the big he was saying that like the big traditional sauna that they have their traditional sauna that they have their traditional sauna that they have their command doesn't get him to the selft command doesn't get him to the selft command doesn't get him to the selft talk mode. He just does a 30 minute talk mode. He just does a 30 minute talk mode. He just does a 30 minute session. Feels good afterwards. But um session. Feels good afterwards. But um session. Feels good afterwards. But um that's how he compared it to the hot box that's how he compared it to the hot box that's how he compared it to the hot box whereas like you know the hot box is so whereas like you know the hot box is so whereas like you know the hot box is so intense it gets you to the mental intense it gets you to the mental intense it gets you to the mental screaming point a little bit sooner and screaming point a little bit sooner and screaming point a little bit sooner and afterwards you feel like it's you know a afterwards you feel like it's you know a afterwards you feel like it's you know a lot more effective. Um and that's that lot more effective. Um and that's that lot more effective. Um and that's that was kind of like the the main focus was kind of like the the main focus was kind of like the the main focus there with the performance. But but there with the performance. But but there with the performance. But but yeah, I love that. um the comparison of yeah, I love that. um the comparison of yeah, I love that. um the comparison of ice and uh heat, you know, they're ice and uh heat, you know, they're ice and uh heat, you know, they're totally opposite. totally opposite. totally opposite. We get a lot of questions, well, what's We get a lot of questions, well, what's We get a lot of questions, well, what's the optimal temperature? What's the the optimal temperature? What's the the optimal temperature? What's the optimal time? Um I get tired of these optimal time? Um I get tired of these optimal time? Um I get tired of these questions because there is no optimal questions because there is no optimal questions because there is no optimal time or temperature. It depends upon
46:00time or temperature. It depends upon time or temperature. It depends upon your prior state of training. And people your prior state of training. And people your prior state of training. And people get this with weight training. It's get this with weight training. It's get this with weight training. It's like, what's the optimal weight for my like, what's the optimal weight for my like, what's the optimal weight for my bench press? What's the optimal number bench press? What's the optimal number bench press? What's the optimal number of reps? That's the wrong question. The of reps? That's the wrong question. The of reps? That's the wrong question. The the right question is what's the right the right question is what's the right the right question is what's the right weight for you? What's the right number weight for you? What's the right number weight for you? What's the right number of reps for you? Because it depends upon of reps for you? Because it depends upon of reps for you? Because it depends upon your prior state of weight training. The your prior state of weight training. The your prior state of weight training. The right temperature and the right duration right temperature and the right duration right temperature and the right duration of cold depends upon your state of cold of cold depends upon your state of cold of cold depends upon your state of cold acclamation. The same thing is true of acclamation. The same thing is true of acclamation. The same thing is true of sauna. The right temperature and the sauna. The right temperature and the sauna. The right temperature and the right duration depends upon the state of right duration depends upon the state of right duration depends upon the state of training of your body. If you're highly training of your body. If you're highly training of your body. If you're highly cold or sorry, if you're highly heat cold or sorry, if you're highly heat cold or sorry, if you're highly heat acclimated, you need a higher acclimated, you need a higher acclimated, you need a higher temperature or a longer duration, which temperature or a longer duration, which temperature or a longer duration, which it sounds like your buddy already is. it sounds like your buddy already is. it sounds like your buddy already is. But when you combine them in thermal But when you combine them in thermal But when you combine them in thermal contrast therapy, this is what I've contrast therapy, this is what I've contrast therapy, this is what I've discovered. You come out of the Morosco, discovered. You come out of the Morosco, discovered. You come out of the Morosco, your skin temperature is cold, your core your skin temperature is cold, your core your skin temperature is cold, your core body temperature probably hasn't dropped body temperature probably hasn't dropped body temperature probably hasn't dropped a heck of a lot, but your skin is wet. a heck of a lot, but your skin is wet. a heck of a lot, but your skin is wet. You're going to get some more You're going to get some more You're going to get some more evaporative cooling. You go into the evaporative cooling. You go into the evaporative cooling. You go into the sauna. If the sauna is like an infrared
47:00sauna. If the sauna is like an infrared sauna. If the sauna is like an infrared 145 degrees Fahrenheit, it's going to 145 degrees Fahrenheit, it's going to 145 degrees Fahrenheit, it's going to take like an hour for you to break a take like an hour for you to break a take like an hour for you to break a sweat because you are already starting sweat because you are already starting sweat because you are already starting in a cooled state. When you do thermal in a cooled state. When you do thermal in a cooled state. When you do thermal contrast therapy, you need a very hot contrast therapy, you need a very hot contrast therapy, you need a very hot sauna to pair with a very cold ice bath. sauna to pair with a very cold ice bath. sauna to pair with a very cold ice bath. Cold ice bath gives you basil Cold ice bath gives you basil Cold ice bath gives you basil constriction. The smooth muscle tissues constriction. The smooth muscle tissues constriction. The smooth muscle tissues around your blood vessels. It contracts around your blood vessels. It contracts around your blood vessels. It contracts and it like prevents the blood from and it like prevents the blood from and it like prevents the blood from flowing into your limbs. keeps it all in flowing into your limbs. keeps it all in flowing into your limbs. keeps it all in your core. Then you get in the very hot your core. Then you get in the very hot your core. Then you get in the very hot sauna and it doesn't take an hour. If sauna and it doesn't take an hour. If sauna and it doesn't take an hour. If you're up at 200 degrees Fahrenheit or you're up at 200 degrees Fahrenheit or you're up at 200 degrees Fahrenheit or 180 Fahrenheit seems to be the threshold 180 Fahrenheit seems to be the threshold 180 Fahrenheit seems to be the threshold for me, then you're going to rewarm for me, then you're going to rewarm for me, then you're going to rewarm faster. Now vasoddilation takes over. faster. Now vasoddilation takes over. faster. Now vasoddilation takes over. Those smooth muscles relax. The blood is Those smooth muscles relax. The blood is Those smooth muscles relax. The blood is restored to all of your limbs. You begin restored to all of your limbs. You begin restored to all of your limbs. You begin to break a sweat after about 25 minutes to break a sweat after about 25 minutes to break a sweat after about 25 minutes instead of 55 minutes. And because the instead of 55 minutes. And because the instead of 55 minutes. And because the evaporation of the sweat off your skin evaporation of the sweat off your skin evaporation of the sweat off your skin is what cools your body, your body has is what cools your body, your body has is what cools your body, your body has to get the blood out of your core now up
48:00to get the blood out of your core now up to get the blood out of your core now up to your skin out to your limbs. If to your skin out to your limbs. If to your skin out to your limbs. If you're going to go back and forth to get you're going to go back and forth to get you're going to go back and forth to get the benefit in a reasonable amount of the benefit in a reasonable amount of the benefit in a reasonable amount of time, you've got to go very cold, very time, you've got to go very cold, very time, you've got to go very cold, very hot. Otherwise, you sit around checking hot. Otherwise, you sit around checking hot. Otherwise, you sit around checking your phone, you know, scrolling through your phone, you know, scrolling through your phone, you know, scrolling through Instagram, wondering when the heck Instagram, wondering when the heck Instagram, wondering when the heck you're going to feel any benefit from you're going to feel any benefit from you're going to feel any benefit from this, this, this, >> right? Yeah, totally, totally. And I I >> right? Yeah, totally, totally. And I I >> right? Yeah, totally, totally. And I I see it um you know, every now and then see it um you know, every now and then see it um you know, every now and then you kind of brought it up earlier, but you kind of brought it up earlier, but you kind of brought it up earlier, but um we'll we'll get a comment or two um um we'll we'll get a comment or two um um we'll we'll get a comment or two um from people on Instagram like, "Oh, I from people on Instagram like, "Oh, I from people on Instagram like, "Oh, I could just sit in my hot car for, you could just sit in my hot car for, you could just sit in my hot car for, you know, in Texas, you know, for 20 minutes know, in Texas, you know, for 20 minutes know, in Texas, you know, for 20 minutes or or what have you at 120 degrees or or or what have you at 120 degrees or or or what have you at 120 degrees or 130 degrees even. Sometimes my truck 130 degrees even. Sometimes my truck 130 degrees even. Sometimes my truck gets pretty freaking hot." Um but I'm gets pretty freaking hot." Um but I'm gets pretty freaking hot." Um but I'm like, "Yeah, that's great. it's just 50 like, "Yeah, that's great. it's just 50 like, "Yeah, that's great. it's just 50 degrees shy of of where you need to be degrees shy of of where you need to be degrees shy of of where you need to be as far as effectively inducing heat as far as effectively inducing heat as far as effectively inducing heat shock proteins and um so but yeah it's shock proteins and um so but yeah it's shock proteins and um so but yeah it's yeah it's pretty interesting and I've yeah it's pretty interesting and I've yeah it's pretty interesting and I've seen um more lately um the ultrarunning seen um more lately um the ultrarunning seen um more lately um the ultrarunning space has um you know the these high
49:00space has um you know the these high space has um you know the these high heat long races like our our CFO uh heat long races like our our CFO uh heat long races like our our CFO uh Whitney Dutton she's a psychopath when Whitney Dutton she's a psychopath when Whitney Dutton she's a psychopath when it comes to to running long distances in it comes to to running long distances in it comes to to running long distances in the heat so she uses her hot box to like the heat so she uses her hot box to like the heat so she uses her hot box to like really specifically for heat training so really specifically for heat training so really specifically for heat training so that she can last longer at higher that she can last longer at higher that she can last longer at higher temperatures and um you know like people temperatures and um you know like people temperatures and um you know like people who are very dedicated with ultra who are very dedicated with ultra who are very dedicated with ultra running that's like a very cultlike running that's like a very cultlike running that's like a very cultlike group of people that are fanatics when group of people that are fanatics when group of people that are fanatics when it comes to performing well over long it comes to performing well over long it comes to performing well over long distance. distance. distance. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. Um and and so >> Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. Um and and so >> Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. Um and and so like now we're we're more so um you know like now we're we're more so um you know like now we're we're more so um you know excited about like the the performance excited about like the the performance excited about like the the performance side of things as you know athletes, as side of things as you know athletes, as side of things as you know athletes, as veterans. Um and but but also still veterans. Um and but but also still veterans. Um and but but also still obviously complimenting the the wellness obviously complimenting the the wellness obviously complimenting the the wellness side of things, the longevity um and the side of things, the longevity um and the side of things, the longevity um and the sciencebased uh medical data. Um, but sciencebased uh medical data. Um, but sciencebased uh medical data. Um, but it's just really cool to see it like in it's just really cool to see it like in it's just really cool to see it like in this space to just have people perform this space to just have people perform this space to just have people perform in these like elective uh competitions in these like elective uh competitions in these like elective uh competitions and stuff that, you know, they're able and stuff that, you know, they're able and stuff that, you know, they're able to to check out from reality and go
50:00to to check out from reality and go to to check out from reality and go perform well u go compete in these long perform well u go compete in these long perform well u go compete in these long races across the desert. Um, and this is races across the desert. Um, and this is races across the desert. Um, and this is like kind of a tool that helps them get like kind of a tool that helps them get like kind of a tool that helps them get there. And so we've seen a lot more of there. And so we've seen a lot more of there. And so we've seen a lot more of feedback from people like that. It's feedback from people like that. It's feedback from people like that. It's pretty exciting. So, pretty exciting. So, pretty exciting. So, >> it sounds like your CFO Whitney knows >> it sounds like your CFO Whitney knows >> it sounds like your CFO Whitney knows what she's doing because those long hot what she's doing because those long hot what she's doing because those long hot exertion uh events. They're a lot like exertion uh events. They're a lot like exertion uh events. They're a lot like uh training for altitude. The only way uh training for altitude. The only way uh training for altitude. The only way to prepare for altitude is to train in to prepare for altitude is to train in to prepare for altitude is to train in hypoxic environments. So, you either got hypoxic environments. So, you either got hypoxic environments. So, you either got to go to altitude or you have to to go to altitude or you have to to go to altitude or you have to simulate it in some training bubble or simulate it in some training bubble or simulate it in some training bubble or uh increase your CO2 tolerance might be uh increase your CO2 tolerance might be uh increase your CO2 tolerance might be helpful or train with a mask on. Low helpful or train with a mask on. Low helpful or train with a mask on. Low oxygen. The only way to prepare to oxygen. The only way to prepare to oxygen. The only way to prepare to perform at altitude is to train for perform at altitude is to train for perform at altitude is to train for altitude. The only way to prepare to altitude. The only way to prepare to altitude. The only way to prepare to perform in the extreme heat, and there's perform in the extreme heat, and there's perform in the extreme heat, and there's lots of good clinical data on this, is lots of good clinical data on this, is lots of good clinical data on this, is to prepare in the heat. The thermmore to prepare in the heat. The thermmore to prepare in the heat. The thermmore regulatory mechanisms that your body is regulatory mechanisms that your body is regulatory mechanisms that your body is equipped with require exercise. They equipped with require exercise. They equipped with require exercise. They require training like anything else to
51:00require training like anything else to require training like anything else to get better. If you want to, I don't get better. If you want to, I don't get better. If you want to, I don't know, train your brain, start doing know, train your brain, start doing know, train your brain, start doing crossword puzzles. Everything in your crossword puzzles. Everything in your crossword puzzles. Everything in your body responds to hormetic stress just body responds to hormetic stress just body responds to hormetic stress just like thermal regulation does. The like thermal regulation does. The like thermal regulation does. The interesting thing about hot and cold is interesting thing about hot and cold is interesting thing about hot and cold is about 80% I'm making up a number but about 80% I'm making up a number but about 80% I'm making up a number but you'll get the gist of it. About 80% of you'll get the gist of it. About 80% of you'll get the gist of it. About 80% of those thermal regulatory mechanisms they those thermal regulatory mechanisms they those thermal regulatory mechanisms they apply to both. Most of what our body apply to both. Most of what our body apply to both. Most of what our body does to regulate core temperature works does to regulate core temperature works does to regulate core temperature works in the heat and in the cold. Not all of in the heat and in the cold. Not all of in the heat and in the cold. Not all of it. You don't sweat in the cold as an it. You don't sweat in the cold as an it. You don't sweat in the cold as an example. But when you train in one, you example. But when you train in one, you example. But when you train in one, you get about 80% transfer of the benefits get about 80% transfer of the benefits get about 80% transfer of the benefits to training in the other, which I think to training in the other, which I think to training in the other, which I think is a fascinating u sort of coincidence. is a fascinating u sort of coincidence. is a fascinating u sort of coincidence. When you um put them together, it may be When you um put them together, it may be When you um put them together, it may be that she will find thermal contrast that she will find thermal contrast that she will find thermal contrast training prepares her even better for training prepares her even better for training prepares her even better for those extra high endurance, high heat those extra high endurance, high heat those extra high endurance, high heat events. If she tries it, I'd like to events. If she tries it, I'd like to events. If she tries it, I'd like to hear from her.
52:00hear from her. hear from her. >> Yeah, definitely. Um I mean, she would >> Yeah, definitely. Um I mean, she would >> Yeah, definitely. Um I mean, she would love to talk to you. she's always tuning love to talk to you. she's always tuning love to talk to you. she's always tuning in. I mean, we love your content. Um, in. I mean, we love your content. Um, in. I mean, we love your content. Um, sitting in in the Morasco sitting in in the Morasco sitting in in the Morasco um, you know, helping educate people um, you know, helping educate people um, you know, helping educate people like us on the medical data is is super like us on the medical data is is super like us on the medical data is is super helpful. It's more practical and, uh, I helpful. It's more practical and, uh, I helpful. It's more practical and, uh, I and again more about what Morasco does, and again more about what Morasco does, and again more about what Morasco does, less of, you know, what it is is I think less of, you know, what it is is I think less of, you know, what it is is I think is like super important and that's why is like super important and that's why is like super important and that's why you guys have such a tight community. you guys have such a tight community. you guys have such a tight community. Um, I mean, it's obviously from from my Um, I mean, it's obviously from from my Um, I mean, it's obviously from from my perspective, I've seen it just working perspective, I've seen it just working perspective, I've seen it just working alongside you guys. Um, you know, you alongside you guys. Um, you know, you alongside you guys. Um, you know, you guys never let anything slip. Like it's guys never let anything slip. Like it's guys never let anything slip. Like it's you're sending you're sending people out you're sending you're sending people out you're sending you're sending people out across the country if something were to across the country if something were to across the country if something were to happen to a Morasco to get them back up happen to a Morasco to get them back up happen to a Morasco to get them back up as soon as possible. And um we've we've as soon as possible. And um we've we've as soon as possible. And um we've we've definitely adopted that level of definitely adopted that level of definitely adopted that level of customer service because, you know, that customer service because, you know, that customer service because, you know, that is our community. Our people aren't just is our community. Our people aren't just is our community. Our people aren't just like uh you know, we're not selling just like uh you know, we're not selling just like uh you know, we're not selling just used cars to people on the street. You used cars to people on the street. You used cars to people on the street. You know, like these people become like our know, like these people become like our know, like these people become like our family and um I feel like you guys have family and um I feel like you guys have family and um I feel like you guys have that as well. And it's it's just cool to that as well. And it's it's just cool to that as well. And it's it's just cool to see how you guys have done that over a
53:00see how you guys have done that over a see how you guys have done that over a long period of time. Um I think you guys long period of time. Um I think you guys long period of time. Um I think you guys started in 2022, right? I think that was started in 2022, right? I think that was started in 2022, right? I think that was around time. around time. around time. >> 2019. >> 2019. >> 2019. >> Way back. Yep. Well, sometimes I'll tell >> Way back. Yep. Well, sometimes I'll tell >> Way back. Yep. Well, sometimes I'll tell people um who are comparing us to people um who are comparing us to people um who are comparing us to competitors. I'll say, "Look, here's the competitors. I'll say, "Look, here's the competitors. I'll say, "Look, here's the best way to learn about our competitors. best way to learn about our competitors. best way to learn about our competitors. Go to Facebook Marketplace. Take a look Go to Facebook Marketplace. Take a look Go to Facebook Marketplace. Take a look at all the competing cold plunge at all the competing cold plunge at all the competing cold plunge products that are for sale on Facebook products that are for sale on Facebook products that are for sale on Facebook Marketplace." Some will say barely used. Marketplace." Some will say barely used. Marketplace." Some will say barely used. Some of them will say all it needs is a Some of them will say all it needs is a Some of them will say all it needs is a new chiller and a new pump and a new chiller and a new pump and a new chiller and a new pump and a replacement filter and you you know replacement filter and you you know replacement filter and you you know repair the cracked union and it'll be repair the cracked union and it'll be repair the cracked union and it'll be good to go. People who are selling those good to go. People who are selling those good to go. People who are selling those products they bought from our products they bought from our products they bought from our competitors on Facebook Marketplace competitors on Facebook Marketplace competitors on Facebook Marketplace because they no longer want them. That's because they no longer want them. That's because they no longer want them. That's the best way to learn about our the best way to learn about our the best way to learn about our competitors and you can learn about competitors and you can learn about competitors and you can learn about Morasco. But you can't read about Morasco. But you can't read about Morasco. But you can't read about Morasco on Facebook Marketplace. What Morasco on Facebook Marketplace. What Morasco on Facebook Marketplace. What you're going to learn is from the fact you're going to learn is from the fact you're going to learn is from the fact that you don't see moroscope for sale on that you don't see moroscope for sale on that you don't see moroscope for sale on Facebook Marketplace. It is a zero Facebook Marketplace. It is a zero Facebook Marketplace. It is a zero regret purchase. That's what we're going regret purchase. That's what we're going regret purchase. That's what we're going for. for. for. >> Heck yeah. That is a good thing to shoot
54:00>> Heck yeah. That is a good thing to shoot >> Heck yeah. That is a good thing to shoot for. Um yeah, I think it's super for. Um yeah, I think it's super for. Um yeah, I think it's super important. And then just like that makes important. And then just like that makes important. And then just like that makes it more accessible. Like it gets people it more accessible. Like it gets people it more accessible. Like it gets people using it more. Like if it's reliable, using it more. Like if it's reliable, using it more. Like if it's reliable, they're going to use it more. It's going they're going to use it more. It's going they're going to use it more. It's going to to to >> become, you know, a concrete factor in >> become, you know, a concrete factor in >> become, you know, a concrete factor in their like their habits because it's so their like their habits because it's so their like their habits because it's so reliable. And that's really what we were reliable. And that's really what we were reliable. And that's really what we were going for as well. Like we wanted it to going for as well. Like we wanted it to going for as well. Like we wanted it to be be be very accessible so that you you hit it very accessible so that you you hit it very accessible so that you you hit it four to seven times a week to receive four to seven times a week to receive four to seven times a week to receive the medical data because a lot of people the medical data because a lot of people the medical data because a lot of people I feel like it's so trendy to look at I feel like it's so trendy to look at I feel like it's so trendy to look at the medical data on paper, you know, buy the medical data on paper, you know, buy the medical data on paper, you know, buy a sauna and then eventually fall out of a sauna and then eventually fall out of a sauna and then eventually fall out of the routine because it's it's not the routine because it's it's not the routine because it's it's not getting hot enough or it takes too much getting hot enough or it takes too much getting hot enough or it takes too much to power it or the thing starts falling to power it or the thing starts falling to power it or the thing starts falling apart and you're less likely to use it. apart and you're less likely to use it. apart and you're less likely to use it. And so that was a big one for us is just And so that was a big one for us is just And so that was a big one for us is just like how accessible and reliable can we like how accessible and reliable can we like how accessible and reliable can we make it that way people use it more um make it that way people use it more um make it that way people use it more um so that we can get the feedback, build so that we can get the feedback, build so that we can get the feedback, build the community and build this trust the community and build this trust the community and build this trust factor um obviously to sell more saunas factor um obviously to sell more saunas factor um obviously to sell more saunas but really just to get our you know the
55:00but really just to get our you know the but really just to get our you know the word out there more because that's word out there more because that's word out there more because that's that's what drives us to build more of that's what drives us to build more of that's what drives us to build more of them. So that's uh super important I them. So that's uh super important I them. So that's uh super important I think is accessibility. think is accessibility. think is accessibility. >> That's why we're going to work together. >> That's why we're going to work together. >> That's why we're going to work together. We're going to put the hot box sauna up We're going to put the hot box sauna up We're going to put the hot box sauna up in the Morasco Co store so that people in the Morasco Co store so that people in the Morasco Co store so that people can bundle a Morasco with a hot box, can bundle a Morasco with a hot box, can bundle a Morasco with a hot box, start doing the thermal contrast therapy start doing the thermal contrast therapy start doing the thermal contrast therapy for themselves and have this no regret for themselves and have this no regret for themselves and have this no regret purchase instead of having to scroll purchase instead of having to scroll purchase instead of having to scroll through Alibaba or I don't know, listen through Alibaba or I don't know, listen through Alibaba or I don't know, listen to five different podcasts or do all the to five different podcasts or do all the to five different podcasts or do all the research online to find out what's going research online to find out what's going research online to find out what's going to work. We can just tell them. to work. We can just tell them. to work. We can just tell them. >> That'd be awesome. Yeah, we'd be >> That'd be awesome. Yeah, we'd be >> That'd be awesome. Yeah, we'd be honored, obviously. Yeah, that's uh honored, obviously. Yeah, that's uh honored, obviously. Yeah, that's uh super cool for us. super cool for us. super cool for us. >> Thanks, Brady. So yeah. Yep. >> Thanks, Brady. So yeah. Yep. >> Thanks, Brady. So yeah. Yep. >> We uh we will continue to refer >> We uh we will continue to refer >> We uh we will continue to refer customers to you guys as well. Um customers to you guys as well. Um customers to you guys as well. Um obviously we love seeing like our more obviously we love seeing like our more obviously we love seeing like our more immediate community using the Morasco as immediate community using the Morasco as immediate community using the Morasco as much as they do. Um especially in the much as they do. Um especially in the much as they do. Um especially in the adaptive training space. It's just been adaptive training space. It's just been adaptive training space. It's just been amazing to see um you know the adaptive amazing to see um you know the adaptive amazing to see um you know the adaptive athletes getting in and out of the cold athletes getting in and out of the cold athletes getting in and out of the cold plunge into the sauna. Um Emily Kramer
56:00plunge into the sauna. Um Emily Kramer plunge into the sauna. Um Emily Kramer with Kaizen uh athletes. Um she's there with Kaizen uh athletes. Um she's there with Kaizen uh athletes. Um she's there she's working with some I believe she's working with some I believe she's working with some I believe someone at Penn State doing a uh a study someone at Penn State doing a uh a study someone at Penn State doing a uh a study on contrast therapy for uh um people on contrast therapy for uh um people on contrast therapy for uh um people with spinal injury and stuff like that with spinal injury and stuff like that with spinal injury and stuff like that uh over a long period of time and so uh over a long period of time and so uh over a long period of time and so some really cool data coming out of that some really cool data coming out of that some really cool data coming out of that that really has that niche hasn't been that really has that niche hasn't been that really has that niche hasn't been focused on when it comes to research and focused on when it comes to research and focused on when it comes to research and so um I know so um I know so um I know >> wonderful idea >> wonderful idea >> wonderful idea >> between all of us yeah obviously I would >> between all of us yeah obviously I would >> between all of us yeah obviously I would love to keep providing them with you love to keep providing them with you love to keep providing them with you know heat therapy devices but with all know heat therapy devices but with all know heat therapy devices but with all of your experience I think that we could of your experience I think that we could of your experience I think that we could really really really you know, really flesh this thing out you know, really flesh this thing out you know, really flesh this thing out and show people what what the and show people what what the and show people what what the possibilities are and uh look, you know, possibilities are and uh look, you know, possibilities are and uh look, you know, dig into the research a little bit more. dig into the research a little bit more. dig into the research a little bit more. So excited. So excited. So excited. >> I want to learn more about that. >> I want to learn more about that. >> I want to learn more about that. >> Heck yeah, >> Heck yeah, >> Heck yeah, >> Brady, thanks for joining me. >> Brady, thanks for joining me. >> Brady, thanks for joining me. >> All right. Thanks, Thomas. It's always >> All right. Thanks, Thomas. It's always >> All right. Thanks, Thomas. It's always good talking to you. Are they again good talking to you. Are they again good talking to you. Are they again soon?